The Fence Fairy (yeah I mean FAIRY)

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A new project coming up, old project not finished, truck broken down, and other things in a mess, but it is my lifeHired the Fence Fairy/Fruit/Fag to build some fence.  1 1/4 miles to be exact.  To be built on two different parcels.  1mi on one parcel, 1/4 mi on the second parcel.The mile is incomplete, and built lousy.  The 1/4mi hasn't even been started yet.A typical whiner.  Pipeline dude out of work, and apparently a fence master now.  "Oh, I underbid the job, I'm losing my azz, and I got creditors on my butt".  "I gotta get payed for the full job, or I gotta find other work to feed my family because I'm losing money on this job"Fence is half built, I got cows on hay for a month because I can't let them out on pasture BECAUSE THE OLD FENCE WAS TORN DOWN SO FENCE FAG COULD BUILD THE NEW FENCE.  Dude says he's gonna quit unless he gets more money, and I already got over 2/3 of the money out.  So you pay, and hope the lowlife finishes the job.Dude works for about a few days more, and disappears.  Call the lowlife on the phone...................."uh, where are ya????"" Lost so much money on your job that I had to start another job to catch up and pay my bills"  "I'll finish your job when I'm finished with this job"Well, that was over 2 1/2 weeks ago.  Dude's got my money, and I got squat.Get a call about a week ago, maybe more.  Came in on the answering machine.  "I gotta inner ear infection, and I can't work, but I'll be there near the end of the week"No calls since.Oh, BTW...........the original dood that was supposed to build the fence handed me off to this dude because he had greener pastures to go to.  ANOTHER STINKIN' PIPELINER BTW.  PIPELINERS BE PRIMA DONNA AZZHOLES THAT DON'T KNOW HOW TO WORK.  MORE THAN ONE WELD EVERY TWO HOURS SEEMS TO STRESS THEM BEYOND THE POINT OF RECOVERY.Now, I don't what's all involved in pipe welding, but it seems that this dooooood isn't too good when it comes to welding in anything but a circle.  Horizontal welds seem to be out of reach for this doooooood.And it seems that these guys aren't too familiar with the principles involved with tape measures.  Line posts were supposed to be spaced 12' on center, and I couldn't find one under 13', and most were at 16'.And the stupid SOB obviously doesn't know how to measure a gate, or plumb corner posts.THANK YOU MR. TILLMAN  Full name will go up later if I don't hear from the dood in a timely manner, and it will probably go to court.Not a full set of pics, but you be the judge.Pics of half used rolls of wire, cutoff lengths of wire laying all over, garbage all over, cementing done improperly will follow. Attached Images"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:The stupid azzhole doesn't have a clue about fence building.  YOU DO NOT PUT A LINE POST IN A LOW SPOT UNLESS YOU BRACE THE WIRE BELOW THE POSTTHE PULL POST SHOULD HAVE BEEN IN THE LOW SPOT WITH WELD ON CLIPS TO HOLD THE WIRE FROM PULLING UPI 've had to hang the gates, which he didn't complete.  Because it's dry, I've had to hang all of them on chains.  I can't use the arc welder because of the dry grass, and had to fuse the chain with the 0/A torch(no sparks).  I can't go back and hang the gates properly until I modify my herbicide sprayer to handle water thru a hose and a spray gun.THANK YOU MR. TILLMANAll the time, here on the net, and around here in OK, I have people tell me that they're the best welder, truck driver, dozer operator, etc.  I think they're all full of sh!tAnd you wonder why I can sometimes be a very grouchy old bastard Attached Images"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Anybody got a good eye??????The corner posts were sunk 3 feet in the ground, and supposed to be fully concreted.SEE ANY EXCESS DIRT AROUND THE POSTS???????  WHERE THE F DID THE DIRT GOI'LL TELL YA.................THE BASTARD SHOVELED THE DIRT BACK IN THE HOLE BEFORE HE ADDED CONCRETE AT THE TOP MOST PART OF THE HOLEGREAT LABOR SAVER HUH??????????I DIDN'T CATCH ON TO THIS UNTIL I ADDED UP THE CONCRETE USED COMPARED TO WHAT I BOUGHT FOR USE.  GOT SH!TLOADS OF LEFTOVER CONCRETE, AND LINEPOSTS.THIS GUY IS A F##K"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Lately, every now and then, you dropped a hint about this fence dude.Now i know why you been stressin'.Nothing worse than a BS tradesman.I cant believe that weld is from a pro.  Sam, you could out-stick this dude any day.Hope it all pans out good in the long run, but not much to celebrate now.Will send the hit squad from OZ.  We will do some arc welding on his eye balls.
Reply:Sorry to hear about your woes farmersamm. I've read your thread about your truck electronics boondoggle. Computers, modules and vehicle electronics defeat me mentally and physically. I have a '97 Honda Accord that has NO brake lights and is stuck in Park because of it. I've bought the books and fixed everything mentioned in them, still no brake lights for over a year now. Lots of people with the same problem on the internet, but no solutions to be found.There are some pipe weldors that are real weldors and know about and understand physical labor, fence building requiring such. But I've met many working in the  chemical plants in and around Houston that couldn't operate a tape measure, torch or even tie a knot in a rope. They didn't pull their own leads, carry their own tools, do ANY grinding (OH GOD), nothing except weld. Excellent X-ray pipe weldors...good for nothing else. Lacking personalities.The sad truth is many were spawned as such in the mid '70's and never learned any better. Some grew up, and became real weldors, some didn't, because there are still many out there. Mr.Tillman sounds like one of them.Only when the last tree has died and the last river has been poisoned and the last fish has been caught will we realize we cannot eat money.                                         -Cree Indian ProverbSA 200 LincolnVictor Torches
Reply:That is disgusting. My daughter can weld better than that.Would pay the dude a visit, doubt that he will be back.
Reply:Bury him somewhere in (on?) the back 40 Sam.MikeConstans Fides et IntegritasLincoln Weldanpower 150 ACAirco Aircomatic MIGet CAV II w/ spoolgunMillermatic 30a wirefeeder
Reply:Are you sure you want this character back on your property to do anything other than refund your money which sounds like a snowballs chace in hell? I wouldn't let him build a button for a ****house door.....Mike
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammPipeline dude out of work, . . .
Reply:Sam - This one is a tough one.  I am curious, how much lower his bid was than the rest?  Was he way out of line?  Times are tough and you will have more and more people trying to operate out of their "knowledge zones".  Hang in there Sam sh!t like this can make you crazy.Charlie
Reply:Sam - I try to weld everything I can, but fence ain't one of 'em. I sold fence and farm supplies for 8 years, majored in Agriculture, took an Ag Engineering course 30+ years ago, and built fence as a side job, and unless your soil is a lot different than here, you would have been much better off with properly installed pressure treated wood posts. I think it would last longer and probably would have cost a lot less, too. That don't help after the fact, but you might consider it next time. If your interested in the "Ag School solution", let me know and I will pm or post their recommended methods for end and line brace assemblies.I hope it works out for you. Money is too hard to come by now for some deadbeat to scam you out of it.Burt _____________________Miller Syncrowave 250Millermatic 211Miller 375 Plasma Cutter Hobart Handler 12010FtDrillBit.com
Reply:if it was me, id take him to small claims court and make him pay for everything to be re-done via a real fencer. then you should slander his name to everyone who can hear. im my opinion if you do crappy work and dont give a dam, they im gonna do my best to run you outta town!!I break things for a living...
Reply:Sucks to hear you're having so much problems with this guy Sam.  Couple questions for you though:Why do you say you shouldn't put line posts in the low spots?  Around here I see them put in low spots all the time, curious as to your reasoning for not liking that.  Why didn't you do this job yourself?  Simply the fire issue?  Why set those posts in concrete?  From the pictures you post it look pretty dry there, I wouldn't worry about the posts rusting out anytime in my lifetime.
Reply:Having a brick wall put up at my house taught me my lesson. NEVER contract an unknown to do a large job. If you have 1 mile of fence or in my case, block wall to do. Hire them to do a small section. Check their work and move on sections at a time. If you write the contract up for sections at a time and payments accordingly, you can cut your losses before it gets out of control.My pool company built my block wall and it sucks. I had a local bricklayer do another section for my side yard and it sucks. Come to think of it, most contractors suck. They all suck. Suck. Suck Suck. So does Obama!Dang it Samm, we both just should have done it ourselves!!!Lincoln Power Mig 210MP MIGLincoln Power Mig 350MP - MIG and Push-PullLincoln TIG 300-300Lincoln Hobby-Weld 110v  Thanks JLAMESCK TIG TORCH, gas diffuser, pyrex cupThermal Dynamics Cutmaster 101My brain
Reply:Joker how did you get th President of the United States to build you a wall? I didn't even know he was a contractor. I guess you learn some thing new every day. BTW I heard we have a former President looking for work who is a real entepreneur and a damn fine businessman. Give him a call.
Reply:A guy that lives around here hired a contractor that does fencing around oil wells, to build a post type fence.He showed the contractor how hard and rocky the ground would be to dig post holes, contractor said "No problem".Fence was built straight, posts were even and the wire was tight, guy was paid and went his way.Fence was caught in a flood and washed out a short stretch.The contractor had dug the hole until he hit a rock and sawed the extra length off of the posts.Some were only in the ground 6 or so inches.
Reply:Psst! Hey Samm. Didn't anyone tell you not to deal with a fence ? They're all crooks! Oh wait, you meant something else. Never mind.You know darn well why those posts aren't on 12' centers. Bigger space / less posts, less work. Big home builders around me do the same thing. Cheat and hope they don't get caught. If they get caught, try and find an excuse to drag it out and hope the customer gives up and doesn't care or gets some one else to fix it. Also I've seen some of these guys that are out of work right now. They are out because when all people needed was a warm body they had a job. Now that everyones cutting back, guess who's first to go? So out they go to work for themselves.I have a feeling court will be your only good option as much as it hurts me to say that. Document EVERYTHING from this point on. Photograph EVERYTHING! Down to the last post and bad weld. Picts of you showing how far apart the posts should be (12 ' pole marked in 1 foot increments is a good tool for the picts) I hate to say it, I've been burned by people who play the "take em to court so we don't have to pay" game. If you want to win, and in your case you should be entailed to win. You want overwhelming evidence of how bad this guy was. If you can show a million reasons why, the end result should be you get a judgment for all your money back. Whether you can collect any or not is another matter. Push for something solid from the judge, a lien on equipment, or what ever..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:What a pipe welder who can't even put an endcap on without buring 20 holes in it and leaving it.safety last
Reply:Lol you should have known. Pipeliners can't weld anything but pipe. period the end.
Reply:Samm that pipe cap looks like Fidos Azz! I guess he didnt own a plumbob or a level either. Catch that Fairy and knock his lights out. I cant imagine why he is out of work with nice welds like that!.............................."Look Good Doing It"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Reply:Samm, I sure am sorry to hear about your trouble with fence dude.You just reenforced my policy of doing everything myself.I've only hired one contractor... ever.It was to have my new electric service installed. The only reason I hired him was to make it happen quickly, and expedite the inspection process. I didn't need the expertise, but I was able to do it without taking time off work and having to run the genset.The only difference from your situation was that I didn't get burned.  I did hold the final payment till I had a sticker on the new panel.I hope it works out. Good luck.
Reply:Holy ----.Looks like you got a sour apple!
Reply:Wow Sam that is horrible.  That weld looks like the first one I ever tried ten years ago!  Posts aren't a hard thing to install plumb and level.  Sucks you got taken for.  Like mentioned take lots of pictures and document every phone call or email to him.  Write everything down.  Send a certafied letter to him giving him 24 hours to get in touch with you.  Document everything that is wrong, and if some things happen to go bad since he has left to make him look worse, if that's posible!  And also get another estimate or 2 from real fence guys and get their opinions on his work.  Then file a suit and at least he will have a judgement and maybe someday down the road you might get your money back, if he ever tries to sell a house or something.  It doesn't matter if he needs other work to feed his family, might be harsh but he gave you a price to do a job and he needs to complete it weather it costs him 10,000 out of his own pocket.  Would he give you any extra profits if he got the job done for under what he bid, no.  Did you have a contract with this guy?  I hope so.You seem like a hard working guy and sucks that some dirt bag saw some of your money and thought he could make a quick buck and left you out to dry.
Reply:Fool me once-shame on you!Fool me twice-SHAME ON ME!'Dude says he's gonna quit unless he gets more money, and I already got over 2/3 of the money out. So you pay, and hope the lowlife finishes the job.Dude works for about a few days more, and disappears. Call the lowlife on the phone...................."uh, where are ya????"Sam-I like and respect you......but--you enabled Mr. Tillman to play you for all he could. Making the final payment, as you did, just ain't dun--until thejob is complete and satisfactory......even if the dawning of the Accopolypsehas been scheduled for the next day!IOW--he fooled you once, then you let him do it a second time.In CA, and most states--you may find the best clout you've got for recourse;would be with the state contractor's licensing board, regardless of whetherhe's a licensed contractor or not.I don't get excited about vendor low bids--I get nervous and ask questionsof them. I emphasize that I'm more interested in the correct work/material/servicethan trying to find the lowest g-d**n price.It's never a problem to find somebody who sez they can do whatevercheaper. That doesnt' mean Jack Sh*t-to me. Expecting some yaa-hooto actually come thru on a low-ball quote just opens the door for all kindsof hassle, grief and aggravation......and on occasions, I've used a reputable fence contractor.He understands me, I understand him.Blackbird
Reply:if you listen real hard, and breath real quiet, you can hear the sound of fingers breaking.On larger projects I put out for bid that get 10+ bids submitted i ALWAYS throw out the lowest two.   Unless i have worked with the contractor in the past and then i will ask them to go back and take a look at their bid.  90% of the time They thank me for asking them if they missed something and re submit their bid.Vantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:Originally Posted by dave powelsonFool me once-shame on you!Fool me twice-SHAME ON ME!'Dude says he's gonna quit unless he gets more money, and I already got over 2/3 of the money out. So you pay, and hope the lowlife finishes the job.Dude works for about a few days more, and disappears. Call the lowlife on the phone...................."uh, where are ya????"Sam-I like and respect you......but--you enabled Mr. Tillman to play you for all he could. Making the final payment, as you did, just ain't dun--until thejob is complete and satisfactory......even if the dawning of the Accopolypsehas been scheduled for the next day!IOW--he fooled you once, then you let him do it a second time.In CA, and most states--you may find the best clout you've got for recourse;would be with the state contractor's licensing board, regardless of whetherhe's a licensed contractor or not.I don't get excited about vendor low bids--I get nervous and ask questionsof them. I emphasize that I'm more interested in the correct work/material/servicethan trying to find the lowest g-d**n price.It's never a problem to find somebody who sez they can do whatevercheaper. That doesnt' mean Jack Sh*t-to me. Expecting some yaa-hooto actually come thru on a low-ball quote just opens the door for all kindsof hassle, grief and aggravation......and on occasions, I've used a reputable fence contractor.He understands me, I understand him.
Reply:Hope you get this worked out Sam. A day's work for a day's PAY.
Reply:Man .... that's one eff'ed up mess.  And this guy is SUPPOSED to be a professional?  I've only been welding for less than six months, and even I could do a better job than that .....Sorry to hear you got burned by a lowlife, Samm.  (Been there, done that, landscaper for me, though.)  I don't think I can give any other helpful info except overkill on documenting everything, take him to court, and make sure the judge knows what he's looking at.  Beyond that, I believe you have a backhoe attachment on one of your tractors - a six-foot-deep hole could be banged out in under ten minutes ...... for, um, burying garbage .... yeah, that's it ....
Reply:Are you going to dig a hole next to one of the posts to see if he really did just cap the holes with concrete? To me this is where this guy moves from incompetence to outright fraud.
Reply:Hey Samm - You wanna go halves on a post driver?
Reply:SAMM do you have update on the fence???
Reply:Call him back, then... wait for it... FALCON PUNCH.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammA new project coming up, old project not finished, truck broken down, and other things in a mess, but it is my lifeHired the Fence Fairy/Fruit/Fag to build some fence.  1 1/4 miles to be exact.  To be built on two different parcels.  1mi on one parcel, 1/4 mi on the second parcel.The mile is incomplete, and built lousy.  The 1/4mi hasn't even been started yet.A typical whiner.  Pipeline dude out of work, and apparently a fence master now.  "Oh, I underbid the job, I'm losing my azz, and I got creditors on my butt".  "I gotta get payed for the full job, or I gotta find other work to feed my family because I'm losing money on this job"Fence is half built, I got cows on hay for a month because I can't let them out on pasture BECAUSE THE OLD FENCE WAS TORN DOWN SO FENCE FAG COULD BUILD THE NEW FENCE.  Dude says he's gonna quit unless he gets more money, and I already got over 2/3 of the money out.  So you pay, and hope the lowlife finishes the job.Dude works for about a few days more, and disappears.  Call the lowlife on the phone...................."uh, where are ya????"" Lost so much money on your job that I had to start another job to catch up and pay my bills"  "I'll finish your job when I'm finished with this job"Well, that was over 2 1/2 weeks ago.  Dude's got my money, and I got squat.Get a call about a week ago, maybe more.  Came in on the answering machine.  "I gotta inner ear infection, and I can't work, but I'll be there near the end of the week"No calls since.Oh, BTW...........the original dood that was supposed to build the fence handed me off to this dude because he had greener pastures to go to.  ANOTHER STINKIN' PIPELINER BTW.  PIPELINERS BE PRIMA DONNA AZZHOLES THAT DON'T KNOW HOW TO WORK.  MORE THAN ONE WELD EVERY TWO HOURS SEEMS TO STRESS THEM BEYOND THE POINT OF RECOVERY.Now, I don't what's all involved in pipe welding, but it seems that this dooooood isn't too good when it comes to welding in anything but a circle.  Horizontal welds seem to be out of reach for this doooooood.And it seems that these guys aren't too familiar with the principles involved with tape measures.  Line posts were supposed to be spaced 12' on center, and I couldn't find one under 13', and most were at 16'.And the stupid SOB obviously doesn't know how to measure a gate, or plumb corner posts.THANK YOU MR. TILLMAN  Full name will go up later if I don't hear from the dood in a timely manner, and it will probably go to court.Not a full set of pics, but you be the judge.Pics of half used rolls of wire, cutoff lengths of wire laying all over, garbage all over, cementing done improperly will follow.
Reply:Buy the looks of some of those welds , he no pipeliner.  They can't hire pipewelders fast enough down here.Sure hate to see the problem your in.
Reply:The guy finished the fenceI gotta say he did a much better job on the last stretch of fence after we had some words, and communicated on what I wanted.Corners were built my way, corner posts sunk almost as deep the were supposed to be, with one exception, and the wire wasn't pulled tight as a banjo string.  In addition I provided him with a storypole for line post spacing so there would be no errors this time around.I hand it to him for honesty, and coming back to finish the job.only problem this time around was that his welder broke down on the last day of the job, and I had to throw mine on the pickup for him to use on the last 5 welds.  The skid is once again proving very handy, and fast to use when needed.  (gotta get some paint on the thing  I'm thinking Massey Ferguson metalic gray show off the red lincoln really nice)Pic of fence later on when I get a chance to go back up thereWill I ever contract this kind of work out again......probably never.  I can't stand the turmoil, and aggravation. Attached Images"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:I don't know Samm, the Rusty Metal, Primer looks good on it already. .No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Originally Posted by DSWI don't know Samm, the Rusty Metal, Primer looks good on it already.
Reply:The rusty patina looks fine ..... nothing wrong with that.  I suppose if you really have to, then shoot it in rattle-can flat black or flat gray primer.Good to hear the guy finished the job to your satisfaction.  Shows honesty and integrity on his part.
Reply:Thank's for the up date.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammCall it a patina, and all of a sudden ya become an artist or artisteIt may wind up in Southebys before it's all over
Reply:Originally Posted by duaneb55Glad you got the fence matter worked out Samm.We call the 'color' of your welding skid Industrial Camouflage.
Reply:Good deal that its done.  We do things a bit differently up north here  We generally use treated wood post with steel "T" post in between.
Reply:ok samm that is some sh!tty stuff and i can not believe someone would do that crap.  if you ever have any other fence jobs call us we are in oklahoma and dont mind building all types of fence. david young with young's construction and fence. #5804218180  oh and by the way i aint no pipeline welder i live on a 500 acre cow/calf pair operation and know how to build a proper fence
Reply:am i an a hole in thinking even though he finished good he's still crap? i mean c'mon, you bid/accept the job and do crappy work and underbid it to top it, then beg the client to front you money! and the client has to tell you again what and how he wants it! HORSE CRAP! my word is good, its all ive got. if i screw me, i did it to myself and will live up to my agreement to the clients specs. my .02 cents. pigpen