Round Bale

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How can I get a round bale into a feeder like this one without the use of a tractor or loader, the horse club isnt going to fix the tractor we have....One end of the feeder is removeable, the hopper sits about 18" up.  These are 6' round bales that I have been told weigh around 1600lbs.Thanks for all the assistance with my last attempt at a lift for round bales, the project ended up being a sucessfull failure (resulted in great lessons but no useful product).  The lift was suppose to suspend a bale off the back end of a pickup.... turns out its just way too much weight. Attached Images
Reply:if you are regularly moving bales that size, you should have machinery. Like a tractor. I suppose you could put the horses to work to get their food into the feeder. How does the horse club expect you to get the 3/4 ton bale in there?UA Local 598
Reply:To pick up that size and weight your going to need some sort of equipment.You said "the horse club isnt going to fix the tractor we have...." What type of tractor? And what is wrong with it? Did  a tractor shop look the tractor over, and give an estimate of the repairs?If the side of the hopper opens and the bottom of the hopper sits 18" off the ground and the diameter of the bale is 6'  then your looking 1600lbs at least 18" high if loading using the bottom of the round bale. If using a bale spear then your looking at 18" high plus 3" to center of bale  being a 4'6" lift into the hopper. You could do this this a bale spear setup on a bobcat (if one of the club members has a Bobcat) or lift if using a fork lift (provided one of the members has a forklift).Unless you have access to a Bobcat with bale spear or forklift it sounds like the club will have to fork up for the tractor repairs (or buy another tractor).Co-Own CNC shop:Miller :1251 plasma cutter, MaxStar 700 TIG/Stick, & XMT 456 Multiprocess Welder.&  2 Hypertherm HPR260's Plasma CutterSorry I had a bad stroke but now I am back.
Reply:The feeder you have is designed to be loaded with a machine. Note the direction of the bale. Maybe if the feeder was modified you could back the truck up to it and roll the bale out, assuming your buying hay one at a time from the feed store and they are loading you. I have a friend that keeps horses and he rolls all his hay out of the barn and feeds on a slab. May not be an option in your climate. He really needs a tractor but he's done it this way for years.Have you seen the universal hay trailer?
Reply:Do you have to move the bales a long way to the feeder, or just lift them up into it?  I think you could come up with a system using something flat to lay the bale on (on its side) with a hinge at the bottom, and a shelf at the height you want the bale to sit at.  Rig up some pulleys in strategic locations then tie em off to the horses.  Have the horses walk forward rotating the flat sheet w/ the bale on it up into the vertical position, then a little past so the bale slides into the hopper.  I think to build any contraption like that it will take more time and money than it will to just fix the tractor.  Usually there ain't much to tractors, how hard could it be to fix it?  There is no easy way to lift 1600lb in a field without spending a ton to build something ridiculous, or having a tractor/forklift.Millermatic 135Syncrowave 250
Reply:The only thing I can think that might work is the tow behind trailers with a beam hoist that I see some of the precast concrete companies use. Often they are used to move concrete casket vaults or small septic tanks. I can't find a pict, but it's basically an I beam thats cantilevered off the end of a trailer sopported by 4 posts on the trailer frame. They slide the load out to the end of the beam on a trolley and raise/lower it with a hoist or chain fall.Not exactly a small simple project, and by the time you are done it would probably be cheaper to fix the tractor. Maybe you can find someone with a wrecker to hoist the bales, or find a cheap larger truck to outfit with a gin pole rig. I always find it amazing how much money people will spend to have a horse and yet still be cheap..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:For emergency use, build an inclined ramp (of whatever length and incline needed) leading to the bin, jack the bale up enough or run it over railroad ties so you can wrap a long chain, cable or rope around the bale a few times (preferably ending on top in the direction of travel) and then use the horses or some oxen to roll the bale up the ramp and into place, pulling on the free end of the line.BTW, How many tons is the bale?Samm, any better ideas?.Last edited by Oldiron2; 06-17-2010 at 12:40 PM.
Reply:down in east texas your average round bale weights around 1200-1500lbs - but that all depends on how tight they pack it when they bale it - Ive been baling hay and moving it for 4 years now with my buddy who bales for a living - and basically you have 2 options that i can see - as far as traditional methods go. the first of which is to put the bale in the back of a truck (im hoping you have a truck with trying to work with hay) and drop the bale in the field wherever you want it - then getting a small round bale pin from tractor supply for like $100the other option would be to use a tractor - if you are trying to move multiple bales a week and dont have a tractor with a front loader you are just pissing in the wind.trying to man handle a 1200-1500lb is going to eventually get you hurt - tractors are a NECESSITY when working with hay - i highly reccomnet staying away from using alternative trailers or cantilevers etc, like said above for 1 main reason - Bales fall apart!!there is no telling how many bales i have lost trying to load and unload off of trailers - their weight can shift  and there is no real way to connect safely to a bale without spikes. ive seen too many people get hurt/crushed by bales when they were trying to manhandle a round bale.So really you only have 1 option and that is a piece of equipment of some sort - either spikes on a front loader or a forklift.you need to talk to the horse club that they need to get their tractor fixed or you will have some dumbass city slicker try to manhandle one and get killed or maimed....or you could switch to 2x2x4 square balesLast edited by smokin_dodge; 06-17-2010 at 01:02 PM.I break things for a living...
Reply:Since you can't eat them sell the horses. Or switch to square bales and keep the current feeder, the whole purpose of that feeder is to keep it off the ground so that you can get more bang for your buck. The other option might be to make one side of the feeder removable so that you could still back up to it and roll the bales into it from the bed of your truck.
Reply:lol. there was a post on here about a model trebuchete build a bigg one behind the barn and target the feeder with bales!!! that would be worth a couple misses just to see!!
Reply:Maybe I missed something.!!>?? But just how did the horse club get those hay bales? If one of the members cut & baled the hay how did it get to the Horse club?? If bought and delivered by a feed supplier then ask if they can load the hay feeder for you.I have to agree with DSW!! This club can afford the horses, building/stable, hay/feed, and grounds keeping & taxes why can't they afford to repair the tractor? The tractor is necessity for horse stables and barns for alot more than lifting hay into a feeder.Co-Own CNC shop:Miller :1251 plasma cutter, MaxStar 700 TIG/Stick, & XMT 456 Multiprocess Welder.&  2 Hypertherm HPR260's Plasma CutterSorry I had a bad stroke but now I am back.
Reply:why the hell can't a horse eat hay off of the ground. i assume they survived for thousands of years without having their food served on a plate
Reply:Yup, horses have survived for thousands of years eating off the ground.... however the mess and waste from leaving them at a round bale is HUGE, this is in a small paddock and I really dont want to deal with the mess.  Horses can waste up to 40% of a bale if they can get at it, that plus respiratory issues from sticking thier whole head in and breathing dust.  Square bales are very costly, a round bale that costs $90 can last over two weeks for 4 horses, in a decent feeder, they would go through two square bales a day, @ $9 each....... the savings is worth it.We live in a northern comunity far away from argriculture and order hay twice a year. The club is your typical rec orginization, no one wants to spend money.  All the typical horse related maintainance is handled with qauds and shovels.  Most of us use feeders that arent that useful for reducing waste.I can move the bales with a lift/cart that is towed around but getting them in the feeder is the new hurdle.  In the end I am looking for a creative solution from the great minds on this board.
Reply:Basically you need to devise a method to move the bale from the cart to the feeder. Upload a picture of your lift cart so we can see the whole operation. Also, what is the model of the feeder? Do you have the manufacturers url?
Reply:Does lack of response to previous ideas mean they are not acceptable?Build a Double A frame with a horizontal H beam which a trolley rides on, mount a 2 ton electric winch to it, make a giant 6 or 8 tooth grappling hook (based on units used to lift logs, but with multiple teeth, much longer curved legs, and a top latch for security.Have one end of the frame sit over the rack, the other where the bale can be delivered to by the cart. Be sure to anchor the frame feet properly.Better yet, call the local Boy Scouts and ask to borrow a Sky Hook!
Reply:How do you get the bales to the feeder in the first place?I can't imagine handling large rounds without a tractor. We feed them up to 2000 pounds and it's sometimes a challenge with a tractor. But if you can get the bale to the feeder...is it possible to set the feeder on it's end next the bale? Strap the bale to the feeder and pull the whole works over with a truck or draft horse. Also depends on the strength of the feeder because when it tips over it isn't going to be pretty with that much weight. Totally redneck way of doing it. By the time you design/build something suitable might as well pick up a decent used loader tractor and do it right. Make sure the tractor is sized right. A large round bale at the end of the bucket on a bale spear is quite a load. AlA man is judged by what's between his legs...always ride a good horseMiller DialArc HFLincoln Classic 300DThermal Arc 181iPowermax 45Scotchman Ironworker(2) BridgeportsOkomota Surface GrinderAutoCAD 2010
Reply:build a ramp system and just ram them in with a four wheeler.Vantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:Sounds like you need a standard low budget hay spike for your truck. Here's a crude drawing I just made with paint.  The base is 3"x1/4" leg angle iron or similar with a piece of 4" channel welded to form the T shape. The 3" angle goes across the back of the bed with the tail gate removed. The end of the channel is often attached to the gooseneck ball in the bed. If you don't have one other mounting methods are possible. A winch goes at that end of the channel as well. For limited use a standard super winch will work for a while (I know people who feed all winter with one but there is a limit to how many bales they'll haul before failing). Some winches need longer lever arms or more pulleys for increased pull. Actually for limited use a hand winch will work fine.   The better spikes are made with 3"x 3/16" or 1/4" wall square tube for the spike frame. I've seen them out of lots of things though but it does need to be a tube of some form since there is some torque on the frame. The best main spike is a semi truck axle. What ever it is alloy steel of some form is preferred to keep the diameter down enough to stab the bale. The two small side spikes keep the bale from rotating on the main spike.  If made right it's not to bad to get into and out of the truck. Done properly it should easily lift the bale enough to get over the low lift height you need. Attached ImagesMillermatic 252XMT 304'sDynasty 280DXHypertherm PowerMax 1250Miller Trailblazer 302 EFIOptima PulserXR feeder and XR Edge gun and more athttp://members.dslextreme.com/users/waynecook/index.htm
Reply:Just running something thru my pea brain here not having worked around animals so feel free to flame me.1: Lay the cage on it's side2: Attach two heavy ropes (slightly narrower apart than the width of the bale) to the rail of the cage and string them out on the ground away from the cage3: Put the bale on these two ropes up against the rail of the cage4: Throw the ropes over the top of the bale, over the top of the cage and fasten to the bumper of a truck or??5: Pull the ropes6: It should pull the bale into the cage and right the cage......I thnk :-).....Mike
Reply:Originally Posted by mrmikeyJust running something thru my pea brain here not having worked around animals so feel free to flame me.1: Lay the cage on it's side2: Attach two heavy ropes (slightly narrower apart than the width of the bale) to the rail of the cage and string them out on the ground away from the cage3: Put the bale on these two ropes up against the rail of the cage4: Throw the ropes over the top of the bale, over the top of the cage and fasten to the bumper of a truck or??5: Pull the ropes6: It should pull the bale into the cage and right the cage......I thnk :-).....Mike
Reply:Mike - i like what your thinking but i can say from personal experience that doing anything like that is WAY TOO DANGEROUS.
Reply:Originally Posted by mrmikeyI realize 100% that you're right. I like to think outside the box which sometimes get me in trouble. It came to mind when, of all things, I had seen a beer commercial and they were loading kegs up a ramp.....Mike
Reply:....ud fit in just right with the oilfield boys down here -...
Reply:As has been stated a tractor is the best way to go.   I still say that the poor boy bale spike if made properly would do the job if just barely. The winch type are not as good as the hydraulic ones if used every day but I've seen lots of guys use them for years on end feeding cattle with them. The ones that I make and put in flat beds would do it easily but they're not simple or cheap. The last one I made took over $1200 in materials when the hydraulic pump and other hydraulics where added. I do know of one guy who made a winch type lift that would raise the bale in there easily but he was a engineering kind of guy and it was a complex build.   Now I have raised a bale up on my welding truck with just the winch and chains put on there properly. I also know of a few people who have fed cattle that way for years. I never did figure out why they did it since it's so time consuming.   The way it's done is in this crude drawing. You really need two attachment points for the chain at the back of the bed. The chain is in red here. You then run the winch line to the chain forming a Y shaped choker with it. This will roll the bale up on the bed. Now a word of warning here is that it takes a good winch to do this. Small low powered winches need not apply.   There is no way that I'd do this on the feeder itself. There's no where near enough mass to hold the feeder down. It takes at least a flat bed pickup or possibly a flat bed trailer for it to work. What ever you do it on need enough weight to stay on the ground while cantilevering a ton off the back. Attached ImagesMillermatic 252XMT 304'sDynasty 280DXHypertherm PowerMax 1250Miller Trailblazer 302 EFIOptima PulserXR feeder and XR Edge gun and more athttp://members.dslextreme.com/users/waynecook/index.htm
Reply:I liked the bale trailer/feeder.  But I'd modify the designSimply a square feeder on wheels, with a gate in back, and a winch operated bale spike in the forward end of the trailer/feeder.  Use it to transport hay, and to feed hay.Sh@tcan the feeder your using, and build the feeder/trailerFront cage of feeder would be slotted to allow spike to operate, winch mounted on trailer tongue, and ya's in business.  It's simply a single bale trailer with spike modified to be a feeder.  How ya do the particulars is up to you, but it's a pretty simple job.Problem solved   on the houseOh yeah, gotta slant the front cage part to accomodate the bale tilting as it's raised on the spike, or hinge it.  Forgot to put it in the CAD drawing Attached Images"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/Why does it have to be off the ground?  There are lots of feeders that roll over to and surround a bale of hay to feed it.  A couple pins, then with the bale setting on the ground (could be easily rolled to the feeding area with a quad/small tractor) then surround the bale with the feeder.Would keep the horses from making so much of a mess too.MarkI haven't always been a nurse........Craftsman 12"x36" LatheEnco G-30B MillHobart Handler 175Lincoln WeldandPower 225 AC/DC G-7 CV/CCAdd a Foot Pedal to a Harbor Freight Chicago Electric 165A DC TIG PapaLion's Gate Build
Reply:something along these lines: http://www.priefert.com/products/Hor...r-Horses_1950/MarkI haven't always been a nurse........Craftsman 12"x36" LatheEnco G-30B MillHobart Handler 175Lincoln WeldandPower 225 AC/DC G-7 CV/CCAdd a Foot Pedal to a Harbor Freight Chicago Electric 165A DC TIG PapaLion's Gate Build
Reply:Farmersam, the trailer feeder is so slick I almost want to build one. If I was feeding using quads like upnorth that's would be the ticket. The inventor said his prototype was originally square so clearly the design is flexible. I like the feeder upnorth is using... now to make it into a tilt trailer I found the feeder dimensions, maybe this will help you put it in your "cad" program.http://www.omafra.gov.on.ca/english/...cts/06-075.htmLast edited by forhire; 06-19-2010 at 12:16 AM.
Reply:I do believe that FarmerSamm is the genius of the day!I showed his sketch to my better half.She didn't hesitate a bit,she just said"build two,the second one will sell to pay for the first one"Thanks Samm,now I have to backburner MY project so I can start yours.tractor,loader.dozer,backhoe,and all the tools to keep em movin
Reply:What about a bale buster trailer? You'd need to devise a way to get the bale higher. http://www.calhounsalesandservice.ne...%20trailer.htm Attached Images
Reply:bust the bale and handfork it into the feeder
Reply:For Hire,That is the web site I got the idea for this feeeder from, it also has a great write up on the advantages of a hopper type feeder for horses.The construction is complete and I will be moving this it out to the paddock today, I'll post some pics tonight.  I have been using a cart very similar to the "bale buster", it works great but barely gets the bale off the ground.  I am hoping that some sort of ramp to back the trailer up on will work.  How extreem of a vertical angle will a standard 2" ball hitch handle?I'll try to position the feeder in a low spot to make it easier.......Any advice on building a ramp to support darn near a tonne?
Reply:Originally Posted by UpnorthFor Hire, How extreem of a vertical angle will a standard 2" ball hitch handle?I'll try to position the feeder in a low spot to make it easier.......Any advice on building a ramp to support darn near a tonne?
Reply:I've got a Spike set up like Irish Fixit showed only its 12v hydraulic. Had it on a flatbed pickup, changed trucks and didn't want to put it in a pickup bed, so I had a little trailer and mounted the spike on it. It's a lot lower than the truck bed was but it still works for me, since I only have to feed a couple of bales every week or so.I stab the bale, raise it up for transport and set it where I'm going to feed, pull out a little, raise the spike a bit while backing up to tip the bale up on its end, and wrap a cattle panel around the bale. We feed them standing on end because the darn goats will eat the middle out and crawl in and the bale can collapse and smother them.
Reply:I agree with Smokin_dodge about the tractor. I too live in East Texas and used to live up North in Calgary. I have fed my horses on both small squares and round bales. I wouldn't mess around with round bales without a tractor. Things are just way too heavy and way too dangerous otherwise.Fix the tractor, or roll the bale into the pen an tell the rest of the members of the horse club to fork the hay into the feeder. Other than that switch to small squares. It's much better for the horses and doesn't loose the 30% of it's value like rounds do. Also, feeding rounds in a feeder loses another 30% just in hay that winds up being scattered.I fed rounds last winter only because I was given 25 of them and they were good hay. This year I will be feeding our horses squares.Sign on East Texas payphone: Calls to God 40 cents......it's a local call...
Reply:Like everyone has said, to handle these bales you should be using a tractor. As far as feeding feeding round bales to square bales, we never fed our horses hay from round bales. Always fed them square bales. I am sure if we still  ran cattle we would prob. be feeding round bales.Just my humble opinion.Be thankful we're not getting all the government we're paying for
Reply:Best choice... go with 110 # square bales in the first place unless there is some heavy equpment to help U.Next best... a tractor with a  3 point hitch attachment, a stab, which can pick up and move the bale safely close to the ground.  How? zactlee U spin it 90 degrees and lift it  18" or more into a carousel shaped feeder  when U get there? I dunno? There must be a common way but I would choose another feeder that loads to my liking.  Sell the feeder and build one that works easily where u just place the round bale, as suggested. worst choice that works... Front end loader... not stable, can easily tip you over on turns and the bale (1600#+) can roll down on you? U don't want that I think. A choice that works... Samms trailer attached to the rear of something, a tractor, a truck again will be similar to a 3 point set up and will move it safely too, ? is to what piece of gear/feeder and then what?Farms cause accidents... ban farms!  Or use your head, it is very easy to find yourself in trouble. wishing U luck on the final decision.light hearted choice...Sell horses, buy goats, more fun and easier to feed, and taste way better... I loved that where the goats eat the center out of the bale and it falls on themLincoln Power MIG 215Lincoln WeldPak 3200HDLincon ProCut 25Lincoln WeldanPower 225 AC/DCIf all else fails... buy more tools
Reply:Originally Posted by UpnorthFor Hire,That is the web site I got the idea for this feeeder from, it also has a great write up on the advantages of a hopper type feeder for horses.The construction is complete and I will be moving this it out to the paddock today, I'll post some pics tonight.  I have been using a cart very similar to the "bale buster", it works great but barely gets the bale off the ground.  I am hoping that some sort of ramp to back the trailer up on will work.  How extreem of a vertical angle will a standard 2" ball hitch handle?I'll try to position the feeder in a low spot to make it easier.......Any advice on building a ramp to support darn near a tonne?