robots taking over!!??!!

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I'm not positive that this is where this thread belongs, but im gonna put it here anyways...   When i started out on this little adventure called welding as a job, my father advised me that he didnt think that it was a good idea to get involved in the trades at this point in time.  He has been involved in them for the majority of his working life, from plumbing to electrical to working for AT&T, which he does currently.  He says that throughout his career he has seen more jobs be outsourced or go completely by the wayside, like he never thought that telephone repairmen and splicers wouldnt be needed, but with the switch from copper to fiber optic, its becoming a reality because fiber optic cables last so much longer without any up keep or attention.  so he thinks that eventually almost all welding will be robotic or at least semi automated, so there is no reason to spend time honing welding skills.  im going through with it anyways, and i personally disagree, but i was wondering what your guys thoughts on this "welding doomsday" scenerio where
Reply:The robots will always win in the end, unless John Conner saves us.Pray he survives!We want to see something like this in the signature line:Lincoln Ranger 250Miller Auto-Darkening Elite HelmetLincoln 100Lincoln MigMiller Spectrum 375Craftsman 8 galllon gas powered compressorLongevity 200amp Tig Welder LT-200D
Reply:Originally Posted by Stack of DimesThe robots will always win in the end, unless John Conner saves us.Pray he survives!
Reply:I don't see robots being able to take over completely. I think computer programming/tech skills are going to be needed alongside welding to set up the automated welding lines. Machinery will still break that cannot be repaired by a robot, unless the robot can travel into the field and is highly sophisticated at reading "random" breaks/damage autonomously. I think it is technically possible at this time, just not cost efficient or likely anytime soon. Anybody ever seen a cranky bore welding machine screwing up repeatedly? That makes wire feed an unlikely choice for a robot. Not to mention bird-caging. Stick? Well, even with long electrodes there's still the nuisance of frequent electrode changes and problems with sticking. TIG? Tungstens need shaping. Consumable electrodes. That "dip-and-stitch" technique with stainless and aluminum. (Stick too - 6011? Never have mastered that)Oxy-acetylene? Some of the same problems as stick and TIG. Plus gas cylinder change-out.Any situation I can think of will still require a human tech to supervise and replace consumables. I think most jobs will still require the brain power and speed of thought only humans are capable of. "Programs don't think, they just do!" (Short Circuit anybody?) Besides, most machinery doesn't like heat or stray magnetic fields.Robots can still perform assembly-line stitch welds all day long. Very, very tedious. Of course I do remember seeing a news story years ago talking about automation. One of the shots was of a machine designed to test a door handle on a car assembly line. Now I know, it might very well have been staged, (done a bit in TV too) but the machine was running its test 6 inches away from the handle. Definitely not testing much!Ruth
Reply:We had a robotic welder at the company I used to work for.   Before we got it, the company thought the robot would eliminate the jobs of 3 welders and the remaining 1 welder would just run the robot and do a little bit of welding by hand on special sized frames the robot wasn't able to weld.   This was a quarter of a million dollar robot the company bought.   They had envisioned buying 2 of these and greatly increasing the welding capacity of the shop and have only 2 people in the whole welding department, both running robots.   All of us laughed when we heard that speach in one of the company meetings.As it turns out, after using the robot for over 5 years in our shop, the robot could still only do the work of one and a half manual welders on a good day and the guy running the robot didn't have time to do anything else but run it and his 'wait time' while the robot was welding was spent fixing the robot's mistakes by hand instead of welding the special sizes.   We still needed 2 to 3 manual welders to get all the production done, so nobody lost their jobs, just one guy went from just manual welding to operating the robot and manual fix-it welding at the same time.   The company didn't save any money in the long run, since the robot cost so much and didn't cut any jobs.   I think we had the robot for 6 years before the company shut down and at the end of that 6 years, the company sold that $250,000 robot for the grand sum of $4500.  Nobody wanted to buy it.   By contrast, the 3 Millermatic 350P's the company had paid $4500 to $5000 each for, they sold for $3000 to $3500 each after 3 years of use.   I would say the robot was overall a bad investment for the company.  The robot also didn't make any nicer welds than we made by hand.  It made more consistent welds, every weld looked exactly the same, but no better than what we were doing with manual torches.I don't think robots are going to take over the welding world.  They can only work in a very controlled manufacturing environment and only in shops that make thousands of the same part at a time.  A robot would be terrible in a one-off custom or small order shop.  Also, alot of the welding that is done in the world is not in-shop manufacturing.  Repair welding and on-site fabrication will always be the domain of human welders.   Plus, it takes a skilled human welder to successfully operate a robot.  The operator has to know how to identify a weld problem, know the possible causes of the problem and know what to do to fix the problem, so that person needs to know welding in addition to knowing how to operate the robot.  The guy operating the robot isn't just a parts loader/unloader like some not familiar with robots might think.Robots have helped alot in sheetmetal spot welding in the auto industry.  The spot welders are very heavy and took 2 or 3 people to operate before robotic arms were used to position the spot welders.  The robots are faster and reduce worker injuries so for heavy line production, the robots do make sense in some applications.  They definitely have their place in the welding world, but they won't be taking it over.  There will always be a demand for skilled human welders.   Welders might have to move to China to do manufacturing welding in the future, but there will always be repair and on-site fabrication to do here in the US.MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op
Reply:When robot welders can crawl around in the mud and fix leaks in injection lines, go down in a celler under a drilling rig and make a cutoff and weld on a head, fall down on it's knee and make a pipeline weld, crawl around up in the air building hi-rises, go hang a gate, or a long, long list of other portable and difficult jobs then there will be no use for human welders. Until that day arrives the need for human welders is safe.Last edited by Oldtimer; 02-25-2009 at 10:47 AM.
Reply:Back when I started I was told the same thing and that was before any ever herd of John Connor. Factory work and mass production sure automated works. Putting up a building or bridge or making 10 of something. That aint gona happen for 25-50 years.
Reply:a robot can't do what a person can. they could eliminate some production work but robots always screw stuff up and a welder is needed to repair it. i hate robots...... i think were safeonly thing worse than an ugly woman is an ugly weld
Reply:I always said that robots are a specific threat, and it is easy to figure out.Here in Alberta, the welders are trained pretty well. The Oil and Gas keep the wages high.If you want a factory worker here, you pay beans, teach them to MIG weld, and call it a day.If you want them to weld pressure pipe or vessels, they have to get Journeyman certification (3yrs) and then pass the "b" performance qualification( 6" sch.80 5G). Then, they have to pass a job test when they apply, usually in 6G.Then, they get paid a ton of money. The guys that stand there on a spool or pour weld into vessels are going to be the first out as it is the easiest to set-up for and it has the potential to save the most amount of money. Look at sub-arc. If you don't have about 2-3 in your shop, you are not at full potential.Why replace a guy that makes $15/hr when you can replace a $40/hr?The guys that weld on their head are safe!!!!