Understanding through experience only?

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I started Phase 5 today- that would be open root 2G, 6010/7018 this week.Ever since I began welding I never really knew what I was doing or what I was looking at. Watching the instructors and mimicking them might get me closer, but I still wouldn't be able to interpret the information in front of me.The closest I have gotten to "understanding" is running 7018 vertical on plate- seeing the whole puddle, watching it wash over the bevel... it was fairly simple for me (and I can't quite explain that, either.)We're back to horizontal now, and I didn't do very well last time on plate 2G. I don't know why- I have a hard time visualizing what is "correct" for this position.anyway, I don't quite understand how a 6010 rod works anymore (if I did once upon a time, I've forgotten). I don't understand the limit of what I can do, or what I should be looking for.basically- watching a demo may show you what's right, but I can't explain what's wrong.I can't explain why mistakes happen or how to correct them, I can only see that they're mistakes. I don't understand the relationship between keyhole, gap, land, heat, I just do it and cross my fingers it comes out OK...I tried studying the "defects" portion of my textbook to figure out the reasoning, but it did not go into very much detail. Is there some book or other that explains mistakes?At this point I'm reinventing the wheel and going nowhere fast. Without understanding, I don't have anything to focus on and getting better is a matter of luck...The best way to improve, I would think, would be to have the instructor constantly supervising me and pointing out my mistakes so we could correct it on the spot... however, my instructor has to watch over 20 or so students and I cannot physically keep him in my booth forever.Advice given from a visual inspection after the fact tends to be fairly vague and hard to apply.I'm sort of at a loss here (and I've probably posted something like this topic before).Keeping it down in the hood...literally!
Reply:Are you able to make that "perfect weld"?If so, practice what you did to make that one.  Muscle memory plays a key in what ever you do, but especially for welding.  Make 2" welds then have them inspected.  You will be searching out your instructor many more times, but will be told what's wrong with the weld each time it's not "perfect".Once you begin to understand your mistakes, you can adjust your technique to improve your weld.  Perfection is a goal many strive for the rest of their lives.  Knowing when a weld is bad, how to grind it out & start over (when is important too) you will get to the point any weld you do will have that "perfect weld" muscle memory.Remember, school is to teach you techniques & skills.  With any skill, it takes time to become proficient.MarkI haven't always been a nurse........Craftsman 12"x36" LatheEnco G-30B MillHobart Handler 175Lincoln WeldandPower 225 AC/DC G-7 CV/CCAdd a Foot Pedal to a Harbor Freight Chicago Electric 165A DC TIG PapaLion's Gate Build
Reply:Hm... I will try bringing it up more often again, thank you.(The last time I attempted it, I was told I needed to finish my welds first, but I have a different instructor now.)To clarify, we're on pipe this phase, not plate. Sorry if it was unclear. Keeping it down in the hood...literally!
Reply:Yes it is pretty much experiance dude. Not that I'm the greatest welder ever or anything. It just comes differently for everyone. I prefer not to think at all while I'm welding. I heard recently that Sam Snead once said, " if you're not thinking about p%$sy you're not concentrating hard enough". Hilarious yes sir yet its also true. Every time I try to think about what I'm doing WHILE I'm doing it I suck. This includes sports, driving, talking to beautiful women welding, etc and so on.  Just relax and dont think while you weld. Save that thinking for planning out your weld before you strike an arc and for afterwards when you take a look at what you've just welded.Just burn as much rod as they will let you and then burn some more.Last edited by i4sillypwr; 12-14-2009 at 10:04 PM.
Reply:You are over thinking it. Relax, let yourself get in a rythm. I found when I was learning to weld  that learning kinda comes in steps. Be patient, eventually something will click, and you'll understand what you're doing. You'll progress for a while, then hit another mental wall. Wait for it... click, you're making progress again.
Reply:As MarkBall2 mentioned, muscle memory is a major key in learning to weld.  When I took my first class a few decades ago our instructor had a professional visit the class to help us with the hands-on techniques.  The pro would circulate through the class, and while standing behind the student, take the student's stick hand in his own, strike an arc and run a bead.  Once his skill was in-putted to me through my hand and arm, it all clicked.  It was an, "Ah ha," moment.So, if your instructor is good at welding, suggest that he hold your hand and run some beads, if he hasn't done so, already.  Have fun.
Reply:Something simple, but it blew everything open for me.A couple of days ago I learned how to read a puddle. not the "kinda sorta", legit, for real, this is how it works.Everything got better. Caps come out good, root beads coming out good, a few hiccups here and there but I know how to iron those out.Honestly, instructors everywhere should hit you with something until you learn how to read a puddle. It'd save everyone a lot of time...Keeping it down in the hood...literally!
Reply:Maybe this will help.You know how the instructor is always telling you that your angle is critical to how your weld is going to come out?  Well take a rod and position it as if you had put it in your lead and ready to weld, and really look at the rod and the weldmont.  Where the end of the rod is is where the beginning of the energy starts and acts as an extension of the rod.  It's like a laser pointer if it were elongated like a pencil, where the body of the pointer ends the laser light begins and extends out from the body itself.  Change the angle of the pointer/rod changes the direction of the laser light / energy.  Where ever the end of the rod is pointing on your weldmont is where the energy will be directed into the metal, direct to much energy into one plate and the other will suffer the loss and the other will suffer the over indulgence. If you can look at a problem and apply thinking like the above to it more often than not you can solve that problem such as in prepping the surface prior to welding can relate to clearing the ground for the construction of the foundation for a house or cleaning the slag off a weld is allot like making sure you wash a dinner plate thoroughly unless you want the squirts ( porosity ) later after adding food ( new bead ).   Another way is looking at weave beads on something like a %70 bevel, staying on the toes longer than the face fills in the face and gets the desired results much like you would find if you were to spend time playing with your girlfriends toes and feet instead of going right for the goods.  You know that if you dont spend enough time in the toes of the bevel and to much in the face then the weld will cause a ridge to form specially in a vertical up position so spend your time in the toes makin little mama happy and you;ll be happy with the end results.
Reply:It sounds to me like your trying to learn to much at once and your trying to figure out every little detail like you been welding for 10 years. Your not there yet, give it time. Well the same applies here to this, what do you do if your welding to fast, you slow down. If your undercutting, pause a little longer on the sides, use the proper angle, slow down etc, just because he is telling you something is wrong, he is not expecting you to get it in the next pass and nor should you. It might take a few or several. As long as your trying to correct the problem at hand, you will get it. Think that is bad, weld outside with the sun to your back. Now that is something that will give you some problems. There is a slew of things going on all at once when welding. Be paitent, you will get there.  Problem solving never stops in welding, it is forever going.
Reply:You're doing good Drake, just keep marching. I am only a Picasso at grinding because I spent a long, long, long time screwing things up and having to grind them out.Bill LambertArgon WeldingABQ NMSic gorgiamus allos subjectatos nunc
Reply:I have no connection with these folks, but I have seen a couple of their videos which I think they are excellent.  They give a great explanation of what and why in the major rods and the major positions.  http://www.weldingvideos.com/
Reply:Steve's library is full of good information, I've got all of them!  But he does not show pipework or tig work. There is Covell's library, which I have yet to investigate, all in good time, Lord willing! Keep watching your puddle. City of L.A. Structural; Manual & Semi-Automatic;"Surely there is a mine for silver, and a place where gold is refined. Iron is taken from the earth, and copper is smelted from ore."Job 28:1,2Lincoln, Miller, Victor & ISV BibleDanny
Reply:Watched Covells tig dvd twice now and its really good but not great.