Another AC welding question

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As I've said before, I've got some welding experience but havn't picked up a stinger in 10 years or so.  That said I'm constructing a welding table/cart for my Miller Thunderbolt AC only machine.  Using this machine to weld this cart has been challenging considering I learned on a very nice Miller welder at school.  (don't remember specifics other than about 15 switches that we were instructed not to eff with and it had high frequency...soooo nice)  My question is this...I know I'm not going to get as pretty of a weld with an AC welder and I'm also using 6011 rods (they were cheap and all purpose...plus they were what I learned with) but I'm having to drag the rod in the puddle to keep the arc going.  If I don't maintain some contact the arc stops and starts.  I've tried taking the heat clear up to where I'm rushing and blowing metal off the piece, but it helps keep the arc going.  Is this normal with an AC welder using 6011 rods?  Seems like everyone here goes for 7018 rods (and a DC machine).  Any suggestions will be appreciated.
Reply:AC 6011 runs fine if you whip it.  Do small overlaping circles in and out of the puddle.To get familiar with the arc length required to keep the rod running..........do some stringers on a flat piece of plate.  You'll get some idea of how far to hold the rod from the steel, and not lose your arc.The old 6011 welds were the first "stack of dimes".The circular motion in and out of the puddle allows the metal to cool so you don't burn through, while allowing you to stack metal.  6011 isn't a drag rod, it's a whipping rod.  Very fast freeze, with little slag."Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Originally Posted by halfmoa...My question is this...I know I'm not going to get as pretty of a weld with an AC welder and I'm also using 6011 rods (they were cheap and all purpose...plus they were what I learned with) but I'm having to drag the rod in the puddle to keep the arc going.  If I don't maintain some contact the arc stops and starts.  I've tried taking the heat clear up to where I'm rushing and blowing metal off the piece, but it helps keep the arc going.  Is this normal with an AC welder using 6011 rods?  Seems like everyone here goes for 7018 rods (and a DC machine).  Any suggestions will be appreciated.
Reply:Out of position 7014 "Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:I better clarify.I first looked at "horizontal".I think of a so called horizontal fillet as a flat weld unless it's over your head.Anything that isn't over your head, or climbing a wall is a flat weld to me.My bad"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:AHA!!!!!!!!There it is "all position", knew I'd seen that7014 is roughly the equivalent of 7024, mostly used for flat welds and slightly downhill welds.  Very fluid stuff."Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammThere it is "all position", knew I'd seen that7014 is roughly the equivalent of 7024, mostly used for flat welds and slightly downhill welds.  Very fluid stuff.
Reply:AC or DC a good rod to weld some fence posts?  My Vertical posts are 2 7/8"  diameter 1/4" thick, the Toprail is approx schedule 40 (or a little more) 2 1/8" diameter.  I saddle cut the verticals and get my toprail level and then go at it.  Up to now I've used my little (much maligned?)  Box store Lincoln 110v.  Turn it up to "D" and run the flux core .030  wire slowly, power comes from my generator.  Works fine.  Now, I've got my stick welder/generator and want to have more fun  Thoughts?Lincoln Power MIG 215Lincoln WeldPak 3200HDLincon ProCut 25Lincoln WeldanPower 225 AC/DCIf all else fails... buy more tools
Reply:Here's the dope on 7014.Sources:Procedure Handbook of Arc Welding.....Lincoln ElectricStick Electrode Welding Guide..........Lincoln Electric Attached Images"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Thanks for the advice guys.  Farmersamm, the whip technique you're describing is getting a puddle started, moving ahead for a moment to freeze the puddle then back just in front of the last puddle and repeat, correct?  I've done some reading this morning and this sounds like the basic technique.  Thanks again guys.
Reply:Well, I just burnt about 25 rods up trying the whip technique and I've got to say that works the best.  I'm not exactly getting the "stack of dimes" look.  More like the "stack of dimes smashed with a hammer" lol.  It still feels like I'm dragging the rod in the puddle even with the heat way too high.  Maybe that's just the nature of my machine.  Sorry, no pics....wife's got the camera God knows where.  My welding instructor always taught us the weave pattern and I just can't get it to work with this setup.  It's hard to forget what you've had driven into your head and try a new technique when you're a new guy, but Farmersamm's advice was dead on.  Thanks Farmersamm!Last edited by halfmoa; 03-10-2010 at 01:57 PM.
Reply:I'm glad it worked.Now I got to pass the thanks on to Dda52, Thanks Don  (great teacher)Been stuck inside all day because of the rain, but I got out and did a MEGA MONSTER BUTT UGLY WHIP on some 14ga tubing I had left over from the chop saw table.Amps..............at the bottom of the 80amp rangePolarity.........DCEPRod............3/32 Lincoln 6010 Travel Speed..............LIKE A SCALDED AZZ RABBIT BEING CHASED BY A HUNGRY DOGIt isn't pretty, but considering the gauge and the fast whip to keep from burning thru, it's about the best I can do to show an exagerated whip.  (Saw Don do a nice weld on either16ga, or 18ga, in the flesh last year)Anyhow, you can see how the rod left the center of the puddle, then returned. Attached Images"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:I'm gonna bump this thread and add another piece of information.  I switched from high range to low range and set the welder at the same amps and it holds an arc just fine.  Anyone make anything from this?
Reply:On my hobart AC/DC box, when you select high range AC, the output open circuit voltage drops from 80V to 60V...MillerMatic 252, HTP 221 w/cooler, Hypertherm PM45, Lincoln IdealArc 250 AC/DC"I'd like to believe as many true things and as few false things as possible"