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Against a warning here and at the welding supply store, I decided to get myself some argon gas, some aluminum wire and get to work with my Handler 135. The instructions say this machine will weld 1/8" alum so I thought why the heck not. I got .030 wire in and adjusted everything as per the instructions.On the first or second try, I was able to weld a full one inch before the wire bunched up inside the machine where it begins going into the cable or whatever it's called. I thought "No problem. A few adjustments and I'll be on my way. Woot woot!" Well, after one hour and pulling bunched up wire out of the cable and redoing about 6 times, I had an accumulated 1.75" worth of weld. To say I was disappointed is an understatement.I tried various adjustments on the wire spool and pressure adjustment knob. The voltage is as high as it goes and the wire feed at 90 (100 is the end). I did not attempt to adjust the wire feed. I kept the cable as straight as possible so the wire would not have to take unnecessary turns or bends.I'd be tickled pink if I could get this thing to work. I'm not concerned with the looks of the weld as long as I could just get the thing to quit bunching up the wire.Is there any thing I can do to make this machine work?
Reply:I'm not sure than machine has the balls to run .035 wire, but larger wire might feed a bit better. Also what wire are you using? I can't remember if 4043 or 5356 is stiffer off the top of my head, but use the stiffer of the two. You're already trying to keep the gun as straight as possible and that was the other suggestion. Are you using a teflon liner? Thats also usually suggested, not that it will help much. The 1/8" rating is way over rated for practical purposes. The 180 amp 220v machines I've used basically need to be maxed out almost to do 1/8" well with a spoolgun. 1/16" is probably doable. What thickness are you trying to weld?Oh you probably also want to see you doc about some blood pressure meds and maybe some tranquilizers to help you cope with this. In the long run you won't be very satisfied. The machine lacks the balls to run alum well except on very thin material, and pushing alum wire thru a standard gun is frustrating at best. You can't turn the speed down because you don't have the extra amps to run hotter, in fact you may find that you need to run the wire faster to get the needed penetration, which just increases the problems. There's a reason almost everyone tells you to use a spoolgun to do alum, and it's not so you just go out and spend more money...Last edited by DSW; 10-18-2010 at 10:37 PM..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:pushing wet spaghetti thru a straw is about as easy to dodsw is right it is doable but frustrating. might try 5356 .035 wire or look for used spoolgunidealarc 250/250 ac-dc tigidealarc 250/250 ac-dc tig #2 used for sticklincoln sp100hh125dual arbor grinder polisher30 yrs of hand tools52 pitch blocks 6p-26prake gauge -pitch gaugeG&D prop repair 918-207-6938Hulbert,okla 74441
Reply:Save the birdnests that you're creating.The robins will thank you next spring.If you want to weld aluminum, buy a machine designed for that purpose.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:Originally Posted by fishnakedIs there any thing I can do to make this machine work?
Reply:DSW & Prop-Doctor,-I'm using 4043 wire. I asked the salesman to give me the heaviest he had...though he did seem unsure of himself. -In the owners manual, it states .035 can be used for one other application. It called for .030 though for aluminum so that's what I purchased. -I have no idea about the liner. It's just a stock machine that was given to me.-I'm wanting to weld 1/8". -What about the spool gun you speak of? Would that guarantee that I could weld with my machine? How much do they cost?Thanks. The advice is appreciated!
Reply:5356 is stiffer than 4043, but it also takes more volts to run than 4043.So, since the 'small' machines are usually volt/power limited, the manual usually says to run 4043.But as mentioned 0.035 wire is a bit stiffer than 0.030 wire ( ), so that is usually the recommened wire size for the 'small' machines.Did you put in the 'aluminum feeding kit' in your machine? That usually consists of a replacment gun liner of smoooooth nylon/Teflon (to try and minimize friction of the spaghetti wire going through the liner) as well as the U-groove rollers (to not shave or mark up that soft aluminum wire like knurled or V-groove feed rollers do) and some 'special' aluminum contact tips (usually slightly oversized compared to 'regular' contact tips so as to compensate for the greater thermal expansion of aluminum compared to steel).Oh, and keep the gun cable as straight as possible to minimize friction of the wire feeding through the liner as much as possible.It's not as easy as just slapping a spool of aluminum wire in and using pure argon! And even then it is still like trying to push wet spaghetti uphill. Which, as mentioned, is why spool guns are often used for GMAW on aluminum. Or push/pull guns $$$$$. Or a combination as well as larger diameter wire sizes. The best laid schemes ... Gang oft agley ...
Reply:did a fast search and you will need a adapter kit to get startedthen a gun, www.brweldingsupplies.com has everything ya needfor 379.00ioc welding has a gun you might be able to adapt for 179.00, but ya still need adapterkitwelding alum is not gona be cheap by any meansdo a www search like i did ( i didn t go to deep in searching [your job for thatidealarc 250/250 ac-dc tigidealarc 250/250 ac-dc tig #2 used for sticklincoln sp100hh125dual arbor grinder polisher30 yrs of hand tools52 pitch blocks 6p-26prake gauge -pitch gaugeG&D prop repair 918-207-6938Hulbert,okla 74441
Reply:Originally Posted by fishnaked-I'm wanting to weld 1/8".
Reply:Originally Posted by fishnakedDSW & Prop-Doctor,-I'm using 4043 wire. I asked the salesman to give me the heaviest he had...though he did seem unsure of himself. -In the owners manual, it states .035 can be used for one other application. It called for .030 though for aluminum so that's what I purchased. -I have no idea about the liner. It's just a stock machine that was given to me.-I'm wanting to weld 1/8". -What about the spool gun you speak of? Would that guarantee that I could weld with my machine? How much do they cost?Thanks. The advice is appreciated!
Reply:http://cgi.ebay.com/Hobart-Spoolgun-...item5adce18930There is a set of instructions floating around on how to install this with or without the $100 adapter kit, which is actually like $10 worth of connectors to keep it simple for connections.This is the adapter kit:http://cgi.ebay.com/HOBART-HANDLER-1...item563fec1a59this is the how to install video for using the above install kit.I have a handler 140 and have been contemplating getting a spoolgun or trying to feed through the included gun (why I have these links). Keep us updated as to what you do.. I would love to get 1/16 alum capability on this machine.
Reply:I have two suggestions, somethings I have read. The first one is to tie a bar to the cable running the wire, this should help keep things as straight as possible. The second suggestion is various products I've seen that help the wire run more smoothly. It's like some kind of material that adds a slickness to the wire, you clamp the stuff to the wire at some point and it adds a thin layer of it as you run the wire.Although, I doubt much of this is any use. It sounds likely that your best bet is to go with a spoolgun and/or another machine. MIG welding is convenient and all but there are limitations to every process I suppose. That is why I went with TIG welding for my purposes, it seems to have few limitations and some say you can TIG weld just as fast as MIG if you get -really- good at it.Miller 330 a/bp water cooledI believe in gun control, I hold my gun with two hands. If you want to know why, click here.Buy American or bye America.
Reply:Wow.Great ideas abound.How about if you just had a buddy stand by the machine and spray WD 40 on the wire as it enters the liner. That should "slick" things up.Also.The guy who says "Tig is just as fast as mig" has probably never seen an arc thru a hood.Honestly.Reading the responses from some posters is better than reading the "funny papers".Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:For a one shot deal it would be cheaper (in the long run) to take it to a weld shop and have it TiG welded by a competent welder.Fiddling around costs money and the end result will be disapointment and a lighter wallet.
Reply:Thanks for the replies, everyone. I have given up the idea...for now. That said, I have had two people who PMed me speaking of their success with 110 machines and, by pure chance, I ran in to a guy whose co-worker at an HVAC fabrication shop uses a 110 Miller with a spool gun. He showed me the machine and the work. The welds were as beautiful as any I've seen! Any way, back to my experience. On a tip from a PMer here, I used a larger tip (gasp, I actually enlarged one of my tips with a drill bit) which completely cured the feeding/bird nesting problem. I just could not get good consistent welds. Whether it is my particular machine or my lack of knowledge/skills, I don't know. I do know now however, despite the popular opinion here, after what I saw today, with my own eyes, a 110 is fully capable of not only welding alum, but welding it excellently.
Reply:Originally Posted by SidecarFlipFor a one shot deal it would be cheaper (in the long run) to take it to a weld shop and have it TiG welded by a competent welder.Fiddling around costs money and the end result will be disapointment and a lighter wallet.
Reply:It can be done; it's just a major pain in the neck, and it's not really the way to do anything structural or critical. For trinkets, it may suffice. May being the key word!And then, after so much work...... you have it in your hand, and you look over to your side...... and the runner has run off. Leaving you holding the prize, wondering when the runner will return.
Reply:Originally Posted by fishnakedIs there any thing I can do to make this machine work?
Reply:Originally Posted by fishnakedThat said, I have had two people who PMed me speaking of their success with 110 machines and, by pure chance, I ran in to a guy whose co-worker at an HVAC fabrication shop uses a 110 Miller with a spool gun. He showed me the machine and the work. The welds were as beautiful as any I've seen! ... I do know now however, despite the popular opinion here, after what I saw today, with my own eyes, a 110 is fully capable of not only welding alum, but welding it excellently.
Reply:I must agree with DSW on this. I have to say after having used a 110V welder for aluminum extensively, I got some ok welds with it, and some even were very clean...... and shiny...... but not really what you would call good to go for anything structural. Only thing that made them work was the sheer volume of welds, and all the multi-pass welds.And then, after so much work...... you have it in your hand, and you look over to your side...... and the runner has run off. Leaving you holding the prize, wondering when the runner will return.
Reply:Originally Posted by DSWYou missed the point most were saying. It's not that it can't be done, only that your setup won't work well. Note that the guy with the "beautiful welds" used a spoolgun, like most here have suggested. The big issue with 110v machines is that people always want to push them beyond the design perameters. Used to do thin materials, they are great and will do an excelent job. Unfortunately most people want to use a 130-140 class mig as a 200 amp class mig, and they just don't work for that.I'd be curious to have seen those welds and the particulars on the machine, for several reasons. It's always nice to see quality work. 1st if they were well done, the material was probably thin ( wouldn't surprise me at all since this is HVAC work), or the welder was skilled, and used a few advanced tricks to "boost" the output of the machine. That or the welds really were not as good as you thought. (Not knocking his work not having seen it, but I've seen to many guys who had no clue, claim to have "beautiful welds" that were complete cr@p. If you don't know what you are looking at, you can't really rate quality)
Reply:3/32 is about the perfect thickness to weld aluminum with a 110v mig. Anything thinner and its very difficult to keep from blowing through. Anything thicker and you really don't have the power to weld it well.Your friend in your example had an ideal situation. A MM140, which is one of the more powerful 110v migs out there, a spool gun to feed the wire reliably, the exact metal thickness that the machine is most capable of welding, and most importantly, the skill and experience with the process. Your mileage will vary!MM350P/Python/Q300MM175/Q300DialarcHFHTP MIG200PowCon300SMHypertherm380ThermalArc185Purox oaF350CrewCab4x4LoadNGo utilitybedBobcat250XMT304/Optima/SpoolmaticSuitcase12RC/Q300Suitcase8RC/Q400Passport/Q300Smith op |
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发表于 2021-8-31 23:33:54