Farmer Goes For A Visit

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My lady works for an oilfield company, and I usually go down to the shop to swap lies and confab when I pick her up for lunch.I really like the doooods, and the work they do.  It's all heavy duty application.This is about the 3rd trailer rebuild that's gone thru the shop in as many months, while maintaining a fleet of tank trucks, pulling rigs, and other equipment.A nice lowboy that needed some TLC.  Suspension rebuild, and neck modifications.This is being done while a truck rehab is in progress.  Total suspension and frame rebuild, and eventual tank fabrication and mount.  AND THIS IS A TWO MAN SHOPAnyhow........back to the trailer.  The suspension was pretty much toast like mine was, and it's a total rebuild.More in the next post....................."Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:The neck on the trailer is a real work of art.This design is for winch trucks.  The trailer is winched up onto the fifth wheel from the ground.  There is no landing gear on the trailer.  It's a common design in the oilfield.The gladhands are protected by the half pipe.And the bar, and bevel, is used to pull the trailer up on the fifth wheel.Some nice weldingNo fancy gear here   This be the South y'all   More in following post.................."Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:The D rings are well done.Nice overhead on the D ringsRed Thought you might enjoy my visit.  I surely did.  It's always fun to see what's going on when I drop by."Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Very neat!Are trailer jacks just one more thing to go wrong they don't want to fix? Or not take the time to lift up and down?Miller Performance AD Helmet - Camo Edition Soon to have: Jackson HSL 100 - Forest Digi CamoMiller Thunderbolt AC/DC((Currently at welding school))
Reply:Originally Posted by LightsVery neat!Are trailer jacks just one more thing to go wrong they don't want to fix? Or not take the time to lift up and down?
Reply:Ain't that the truth Roy?
Reply:Love the pictures.  I love being able to walk around and see what others are doing.If there is ever any question about the strength of a good shortarc weld, those D rings will prove it.  It took me a loooonnnnggg time to rely on short arc welds.  but after seeing that the lion share of production work is short arc I have submitted that they are indeed as strong as they need to be.  (given that they are welded properly)Last edited by Scott Young; 04-11-2012 at 11:12 PM.
Reply:I was surprised to see hard wire MIG on a job like that , I would have thought stick all day long. Guess it is just to slow."Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum"Lincoln Idealarc 250 AC/DCMillermatic 251   Syncrowave 300   30A spoolgunLincoln MP210Hypertherm 45(2) LN 25(2) Lincoln Weldanpower 225 CV(4) SA200   1 short hood    SA250    SAM 400
Reply:i would have thought dual shield, but i forget how the middle of the country operates.   Our good lowbeds out here are T-1 steelVantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:Originally Posted by Dualiei would have thought dual shield, but i forget how the middle of the country operates.   Our good lowbeds out here are T-1 steel
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammBilly says it's flux core with gas if I remember.  Outershield I'd imagine, since the only good welding supply here is a Lincoln dealer.  We have a small Miller dealer in town, but the prices are out of sight.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammBilly says it's flux core with gas if I remember.  Outershield I'd imagine, since the only good welding supply here is a Lincoln dealer.  We have a small Miller dealer in town, but the prices are out of sight.
Reply:Are any Mig welders capable of switching between short-circuit and spray modes? How are these different modes achieved?
Reply:Does the machine their running have a Pulse mode?
Reply:I got some more info on my return visit today.I was wrong about the wire, actually the machine.  They're running two machines, each loaded with different wire.  I can't tell the difference between MIG and Outershield welds because I don't use either process.They showed me a gas shielded flux core weld.  Pretty nice stuff I should have asked what was used for the trailer welds instead of asking what's in the machine.These are the two wires used in their shop.I'm familiar with Weldmark, it's a good wire I buy for my gasless flux core setup at the farm.  I've never used any shielding gas out here. Attached Images"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:You asked about the lack of landing gear on the trailer.  They simply aren't needed, and sometimes, I was told, can get in the way.The truck has a fifth wheel on the bed/platform.  The trailer is winched up over the rolling tailboard and then sits on the fifth wheel.The truck has two winches.  Probably Tulsa Winches, I didn't look at the plates on the gear boxes.To raise the ginpoles for work, the cable is tied off to a heavy object, then the two winches are used to raise the poles.  There are several ways to do this I understand.  One way is to simply use the winches against each other, but it apparently puts a heavy strain on the poles and blocks.More in the next post................."Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:The cable arrangement.This trailer is ready for the finish work.  Sandblasting, then paint.Then it was off to lunch "Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:GREAT pictures Samm.
Reply:Great stuff, thanks for sharing.
Reply:Good shots Samm.....zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Great pictures Samm as already stated.  A couple things I noticed while reading/looking:The bar and bevel as you call it, we refer to as a "pick up roll" way up here.  I have never built or used one that small before.  It will kink the crap out of a winch line and take the life out of it, but to each their own.  The trailers and jeeps up here usually have a 3" pipe in the necks - even the hi-boys and the pipe has a full wrap on it extending from the bottom of the frame to the top. I am sure it fits the intended application but if I tried to lift a wheeler off the ground after I tossed my jeep in the ditch when I was loaded, I would hurt somebody with that setup.2nd thing, I don't understand WHY they welded D-rings onto a fixed narrow neck lowboy.  I can't conceive a situation where they would be "needed" but again, it must suit the intended applicaton.As far as winches go, I prefer the ones manufactured in Broken Arrow as opposed to the other ones.  Just personal preference.  Both work well,One the pole trucks, the main winch appears to be a Braden MS30T... I can't see running a 50 Ton on a truck that small, but you never know.  I can't get a clean look at the 2nd winch, but I would wager it is a Tulsa because I can see the drive chain and sprocket and Tulsa commonly ran the worm gear "backwards" compared to a Braden with the chains to the rear of the truck and the internal brake to the front.Last edited by Black Wolf; 04-12-2012 at 10:05 PM.Reason: Spelling and winch info.Later,Jason
Reply:I got an eye opener after I viewed the picks of the "Pole Trucks"... I definitely learned something there - I have never seen them manufactured like that.In all the years I ran bed and pole trucks moving Drilling and Service Rigs, I never saw a set of poles raised like that either but seeing how far the snatch block is ahead of the pole hinges, I guess you kind of have to.  It obviously must work... The trucks up here are just made a little differently.Myself, I always tied the winch line into the apron and winched the poles off the make up rack, or make up blocks into working position. Same going down just had to be careful.  It was easier on the fully hydraulic beds as compared to the older mechanical ones, but they too got the job done.I appreciate seeing how things are done in other areas...  Sometimes it makes me a little envious of the equipment others had to use... Sometimes it makes me a little more appreciative of the equipment I had to work with.In any event Samm, Good Stuff and keep the pics coming.Last edited by Black Wolf; 04-12-2012 at 10:14 PM.Later,Jason
Reply:Originally Posted by Black WolfGreat pictures Samm as already stated.  A couple things I noticed while reading/looking:The bar and bevel as you call it, we refer to as a "pick up roll" way up here.  I have never built or used one that small before.  It will kink the crap out of a winch line and take the life out of it, but to each their own.  The trailers and jeeps up here usually have a 3" pipe in the necks - even the hi-boys and the pipe has a full wrap on it extending from the bottom of the frame to the top. I am sure it fits the intended application but if I tried to lift a wheeler off the ground after I tossed my jeep in the ditch when I was loaded, I would hurt somebody with that setup.2nd thing, I don't understand WHY they welded D-rings onto a fixed narrow neck lowboy.  I can't conceive a situation where they would be "needed" but again, it must suit the intended applicaton.As far as winches go, I prefer the ones manufactured in Broken Arrow as opposed to the other ones.  Just personal preference.  Both work well,
Reply:Yes I was vaguely referencing that Braden winches are (or were) manufactured in Broken Arrow.  All the Braden winches I have used have "Broken Arrow" cast into the worm drive case.Spelling for "Pole Truck" is the same.  I was just suprised that anyone would make a Class 8 Pole Truck that SHORT - Must be tippy little buggars and not able to lift much.  The shortest bed I ever drove with a set of poles was a 275" Wheel Base C-500.  The longest was a 410" wheel base tandem/tandem.Man I sure wish you would have quoted my 2nd post AFTER I had re-worded it.  I read it back to myself and it just didn't sound the way I wanted it to, but oh well. I agree you may be onto something with the operator not wanting to thread the winchline under the 5th wheel.  The beds up here have the wheels mounted onto a hinged plate and they drop into the deck before the bed is used or the poles are tossed in the air.To each their own.  I still find it interesting.Later,Jason
Reply:Originally Posted by Black WolfYes I was vaguely referencing that Braden winches are (or were) manufactured in Broken Arrow.  All the Braden winches I have used have "Broken Arrow" cast into the worm drive case.Spelling for "Pole Truck" is the same.  I was just suprised that anyone would make a Class 8 Pole Truck that SHORT - Must be tippy little buggars and not able to lift much.  The shortest bed I ever drove with a set of poles was a 275" Wheel Base C-500.  The longest was a 410" wheel base tandem/tandem.Man I sure wish you would have quoted my 2nd post AFTER I had re-worded it.  I read it back to myself and it just didn't sound the way I wanted it to, but oh well. I agree you may be onto something with the operator not wanting to thread the winchline under the 5th wheel.  The beds up here have the wheels mounted onto a hinged plate and they drop into the deck before the bed is used or the poles are tossed in the air.To each their own.  I still find it interesting.Couple of quick questions... Running the poles with the lower winch, and lifting with the upper winch, won't the cables rub badly under a load?  What about offsetting  the lower winch to the side a bit?The reason I ask, is I've never had a truck with 2 winches on it before, so never had the ability to have live poles.  I've only used a set of poles a hand full of times, usually just move a trackhoe, backhoe or sideboom to wherever we needed to lift something.  But I could get some winch truck work if I had something rigged up properly.  And my truck now has a bit of wheelbase to it, (288") and I happen to have a Tulsa 64 and about 3 Tulsa 34 winches laying around...I mainly want the ability to lower/lift my floats (40' oilfield floats), hook and unhook to my tandem lowboy without having to block it up or lift with a tractor, and use my mechanical folding neck tri-axle lowboy without having to fold the neck with a piece of equipment.  But since I've got plenty of room for multiple winches, and have the winches already... I'd like to rig it up pretty nice.  I'm thinking of putting a Spicer 1241C auxillary transmission with a power tower on it to run the winches also.
Reply:Here is a couple of pics of the tailboard we just put on it.  Also added the Pintle hitch and changed from Fontaine fith wheel to the Holland that is raised.  The reason for the raised fifth wheel is my double drop tri-axle sat too low in the front.  It sits level when hooked up now.  I also built the ramps.  Still need to take the sleeper off, and put a panel on the back of the cab.  Just kinda hard to take the truck apart when it's the only means you have of moving equipment...
Reply:the hitch plate is 1 1/2" plate, we slotted out the bottom of the tailboard, and slid the plate up to the bottom of the plate under the roller, then fully welded it to the tailboard before we boxed in the outside for the lights.  There is also a 1 1/2" "stiffener" rib centered in the hitch, extending up behind the tailboard.  Bought mudflaps for it yesterday, hope to get them on it this weekend.It probably looks like the tailboard is mounted a bit low, the reason for this is my folding neck lowboy.  At this height (42"), if the neck is locked in the road position, I can back under it without blocking the trailer up or winching.  This is how i've used the trailer with this truck for about 10 years now.  You just have to have something to raise or lower the neck on site.  The trailer also has a dovetail on it, so a lot of things I just load or unload over the back.  But it's only an 8' wide trailer, without outriggers over the wheels, so a 200 size excavator is about as big as I can load that way.  Also a dozer with a winch doesn't want to "break over" when loading. (no ramps)  I've thought about putting ramps on the back, but then I couldn't use my dock at the shop.
Reply:Originally Posted by handtpipelineCouple of quick questions... Running the poles with the lower winch, and lifting with the upper winch, won't the cables rub badly under a load?  What about offsetting  the lower winch to the side a bit?It my experiences when using the second winch to run the poles, I have used the load sling and ran it down from the pole cap to a snatch block, then ran the line from the 2nd winch through the snatch block and back to a clevis on the 2nd winch frame.  This "Loop" of winch line creates an area that is more than large enough for the main winch line to pass through on it's way to the snatch block at the bottom of the gin poles in line with the hinges.The reason I ask, is I've never had a truck with 2 winches on it before, so never had the ability to have live poles.  I've only used a set of poles a hand full of times, usually just move a trackhoe, backhoe or sideboom to wherever we needed to lift something.  But I could get some winch truck work if I had something rigged up properly.  And my truck now has a bit of wheelbase to it, (288") and I happen to have a Tulsa 64 and about 3 Tulsa 34 winches laying around...I have ran several pole trucks full mechanical with a single winch, others full mechanical with 2 winches (Main off Power Tower, 2nd off PTO) and also full hydraulic.  They are really common up here.  I have not seen it, but I know there is a bed truck working in Nisku (South of Edmonton) that has 2 winches and hydraulic poles.  The poles are split, sleeved and loaded with hydraulic cylinders - They can be extended at will to "Swing" the pole cap and load without moving the truck.I mainly want the ability to lower/lift my floats (40' oilfield floats), hook and unhook to my tandem lowboy without having to block it up or lift with a tractor, and use my mechanical folding neck tri-axle lowboy without having to fold the neck with a piece of equipment. You can do all of that with a good set of lowbed ramps and a dead roll.  The only trick with the scissor neck is drop it onto blocks before running it down the ramps to pin it flat so that you can still get the ramps under it to pick it back up again.
Reply:Originally Posted by Black WolfI do not wish to hijack Samm's thread any worse with my nattering but if there is enough interest I will gladly start another thread to answer questions and post up picks of winch tractors and pole trucks I have built in the past as well as pics of my own winch tractor showing the lowbed ramps and how I took the mechanical detach neck off my 50Ton Double Drop.
Reply:Originally Posted by irish fixitActually I was talking about your reference to Schlumberger. I understand that now... Whoops!   Luckily I caught it in time managed to edit my post with your new wording. Thank you.  Can't say that I've seen one with a drop down fifth wheel plate. But I've definitely not seen them all.Yep almost all bed trucks up here have 5th wheels.  The older ones were manual up and down, the newer ones are hydraulic up and down.  NICE!  One question from earlier in this thread that I don't think got a good answer is the lack of landing gear on this trailer. I cannot speak to this person's application, but the scissor necks and single drop lowbeds I have pulled in the past all had square tubing flip-down dolly legs that would tuck up into the frame and out of the way so we didn't tear them off.  I haven't pulled any double drops with landing gear as they are made to sit on the ground as the neck is removed and the equipment is loaded onto the trailer. BTW. When I first saw them raising the poles like that I was waiting to see how you would respond to it. It's definitely the first time I've ever seen it done that way and I figured you would notice it as well.Lol... Samm is baiting me to see if I can restrain myself... I guess this shows that I CAN'T
Reply:Please do start such a thread.
Reply:Back on the topic of the truck Samm pictured here:On the winch truck pictured, I wonder if the tail block is positioned where it is so they can pull the narrow neck lowboy without un-rigging the poles?  I say that because I have seen trucks around here pull narrow neck lowboys with the poles resting on the headache rack like pictured there.  You'd have to watch how sharp you turned, or that you didn't bind things up with the neck into the poles, but I just wonder if that's the purpose of the block attachment ahead of the fifth wheel?If that's the case, would you have to block the trailer up to hook/unhook from it?  I wouldn't think you'd want to pull with your winch line running thru the tail block, up over the headache rack, thru the top block then over the tail roller.  But I don't know.  I know I wouldn't be too keen on doing that with my truck.
Reply:Here's a question for you guys, if it needs to be moved out of here, I will, but didnt really know a good way to phrase a new thread title...  HandT's pic show how he ramped the truck pictured.  I have a truck I need to ramp, but the FEW ive done in the past have been pretty crude, but didnt have to do much.  Their only purpose was on a hydraulic RGN I had, the neck would leak down after a cpl weeks, and this allowed us to back under without having to hook up the hoses first..  My question is now I am using a mechanical detach trailer, and need to ramp my truck, but it seems most of the trucks I see go to a lot more extremes than I would.  SO, as in his picture above, why do a lot of the ramps I see hump up so high??  The trailer I have does have rollers, so maybe it loads easier than others, but it seems to me that as long as the ramps get up past the height of the angled portion of the 5th, then its overkill??  what am I missing??  Anyone got pics of other ways you've ramped your trucks??
Reply:Originally Posted by bottlefed89Here's a question for you guys, if it needs to be moved out of here, I will, but didnt really know a good way to phrase a new thread title...  HandT's pic show how he ramped the truck pictured.  I have a truck I need to ramp, but the FEW ive done in the past have been pretty crude, but didnt have to do much.  Their only purpose was on a hydraulic RGN I had, the neck would leak down after a cpl weeks, and this allowed us to back under without having to hook up the hoses first..  My question is now I am using a mechanical detach trailer, and need to ramp my truck, but it seems most of the trucks I see go to a lot more extremes than I would.  SO, as in his picture above, why do a lot of the ramps I see hump up so high??  The trailer I have does have rollers, so maybe it loads easier than others, but it seems to me that as long as the ramps get up past the height of the angled portion of the 5th, then its overkill??  what am I missing??  Anyone got pics of other ways you've ramped your trucks??
Reply:This shows the ramps on my Mack.  I got a little fancier on the Peterbilt, more of a rounded shape instead of just angled.
Reply:Originally Posted by bottlefed89Here's a question for you guys, if it needs to be moved out of here, I will, but didnt really know a good way to phrase a new thread title...  HandT's pic show how he ramped the truck pictured.  I have a truck I need to ramp, but the FEW ive done in the past have been pretty crude, but didnt have to do much.  Their only purpose was on a hydraulic RGN I had, the neck would leak down after a cpl weeks, and this allowed us to back under without having to hook up the hoses first..  My question is now I am using a mechanical detach trailer, and need to ramp my truck, but it seems most of the trucks I see go to a lot more extremes than I would.  SO, as in his picture above, why do a lot of the ramps I see hump up so high??  The trailer I have does have rollers, so maybe it loads easier than others, but it seems to me that as long as the ramps get up past the height of the angled portion of the 5th, then its overkill??  what am I missing??  Anyone got pics of other ways you've ramped your trucks??
Reply:I guess its a regional preferance, but here our fifth wheels are mounted on the trailers, and the kingpin screws into the bed. We do alot of bobtail work on location spotting pumps and such, so the fifth wheel would be in the way.  Im also wondering how much they can lift with those short trucks, as my 310" Paystar 5000 seems a little light in the front at times. Someone made reference to off setting the pole winch, and thats how mine is. Its mounted under the bed on the front right cornor. The other two winches, a Tulsa 80 and a Tulsa 64 are mounted behind the cab like the ones pictured here..............................."Look Good Doing It"!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Reply:Originally Posted by CoyoteI guess its a regional preferance, but here our fifth wheels are mounted on the trailers, and the kingpin screws into the bed. We do alot of bobtail work on location spotting pumps and such, so the fifth wheel would be in the way.