time to cretique my TIG welds

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ok here are some pics of some welds i did they are done in 308L stainless filler on MS 1/4 in plate. all are done in the 2F and 2G position (except for the one clamped to the tree it was done in 3F. all the welds were made walking the cup. let me have it tell me what you think. I have only been tig welding for about 3 months. Attached ImagesOffering CNC Plasma cutting and welding projects.Follow me on facebook https://www.facebook.com/nobigdeal.fabSupport those that support WW.
Reply:looks good
Reply:Overall not bad at all. You still need to work a bit on your consistency. The 1st and 2nd beads the width at the toes varies some as you go along. The last two look pretty decent with only minor issues.Now do all of them and don't walk the cup..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Yes learn to not walk the cup...Lincoln pro mig 180Lincoln Square Wave Tig 300/wp 20/home built water cooler Victor, Purox, Harris, O/A welding/cutting setupsVintage Craftsman drill pressVintage Craftsman/Atlas 12"x 36'' lathe7''x 12'' w/c band saw Everlast 140 st
Reply:So what's the reason behind not walking the cup? Other than appearance? Or am I missing something? I can run decient stringers on aluminum but I really need more practice on steel. Don't ask why but stringers on steel dnot work to well for me. I'll get pics of stringers and post them tomorrow. Thanks for the criticism.Offering CNC Plasma cutting and welding projects.Follow me on facebook https://www.facebook.com/nobigdeal.fabSupport those that support WW.
Reply:Walking the cup is mainly used on large pipe welds... if you test for tube welding usually they want it done without walking the cup. Also you will find yourself in positions where walking the cup just is not possible.... and as far as appearence... You can achieve the same "look"  without walking the cup...Lincoln pro mig 180Lincoln Square Wave Tig 300/wp 20/home built water cooler Victor, Purox, Harris, O/A welding/cutting setupsVintage Craftsman drill pressVintage Craftsman/Atlas 12"x 36'' lathe7''x 12'' w/c band saw Everlast 140 st
Reply:Thanks for the info. I'll start practicing free hand.Offering CNC Plasma cutting and welding projects.Follow me on facebook https://www.facebook.com/nobigdeal.fabSupport those that support WW.
Reply:I'm not a tig welder per se... but have been ticketed in the past for 6G GTAW root to high pressure standards and will attest to what everyone is saying; it is best for you if you learn without walking.  I never learned to walk, although i wanted to in school.  for that matter i didnt have HF start or a foot pedal... it was an Idealarc 250 rigged up for scratch start tig and I am very happy i learned that way... too much heat?  speed up... too low heat? slow down.  if you can learn under the worst circumstances, the best will be easy.  i say now... lemme recert for tig this week on pv and Ill let you know how it goes.   but really, if you are a hobbyist; learn the easiest way.  if it pays your bills; learn the hardest way.  it WILL pay dividends.  i could be wrong though... technically im still very green
Reply:Your welds look good for the amount of time you have been practicing. You should tighten up your weaves a bit, though. I would try to learn both freehand and walk the cup methods. You WILL use both those methods, and will eventually learn others like dripping, scooting, or gliding. A professional weldor has many tricks up his/her sleeve, and besides its good to chang things up from time to time. Demonspeeder is right... you woulnt walk the cup on a boiler tube test... Not like you would have enough room to do so if you wanted to any way  keep up the good work
Reply:Thanks for the compliments guys. A brief background on myself, (as I'm still a noob here) welding for me is important to my side business (metal art type stuff) but it is not my main source of income. Calibrating and repairing life support systems in a hospital is.  So because of this I most likely will not be welding pressure vessels, or be doing anything requiring a cert or even a wps. Although I have spent 10 months in a trade school and graduate in may. So I have been learning the correct welding processes. TIG is my weak point, and want to be able to weld in all positions, in any style (walking the cup freehand ect) and looking for input. I really wanna make decretive welds as part of my business vs just being able to weld the stuff together. I want my welds to speak for themselves on the stuff I do. Instead if disappear as just a way of holding things together. If that makes sence, and freehand will be needed to reach that goal.Offering CNC Plasma cutting and welding projects.Follow me on facebook https://www.facebook.com/nobigdeal.fabSupport those that support WW.
Reply:The tech school I used to deal with got a lot of art students in from the local college. There were two schools of thought from the art students. One was to try and make the welds as small as possible or to eventually blend them in so you wouldn't see them. Often sculpture students who worked with castings and wanted to join pieces together to make a seamless final product. The 2nd group wanted the welds to be a "part" of the whole, How pieces went together were part of the "sculpture". Usually students who worked more with "modern" art or "found" object art.  Those students goals were usually ZTfab or Zap type welds with almost perfect rhythm and consistency. I'm guessing you fall more towards the latter group.To get where you want to go, you will have to learn to control every aspect of the weld and try to do everything as consistently as possible. Learning to really "read" the puddle will go far towards obtaining your goal. Don't just rush to do welds, do each weld with a singular goal in mind and when done try and determine what happened and why. 2 or 3 really good welds are better than hours of mindless crap usually. Learn to critique your own welds. Try and learn to see WHY there are issues. Experiment with each aspect of the weld one at a time, so you understand what is happening when you do what. For example try and set up on 1/8" plate with say 100 amps, no filler for now. Floor the pedal ( or use scratch start with the amps controlled on the panel) and try and control the heat and puddle size with nothing but the travel speed, keeping the arc length as consistent as possible. Once you have this understood, do the same thing except now, keep travel speed the same, and adjust your arc length. Later  try changing what size filler you use and how fast you add filler. Eventually you'll put all these pieces together at the same time. Don't forget fit up. Irregular or sloppy fit up will not help you make "perfect" welds, however perfect fit up will. Don't "settle" for "good enough"... All of these bits and pieces are part of a good welders "bag of tricks".The guys here who make the text book welds like Zap, ZTfab and others, have learned all of this. They have it down to the point they don't even need to think about it any more, it's all second nature. That requires a lot of really dedicated practice and a complete understanding of just what is going on while welding..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:DSW, thanks for that. I see your point. And I try and duplicate everything the same, but at the same time it's school and we gotta get the assignments done. At home though I can practice just what you said as my TA is a lift TIG. And uses a thumbwheel control. So leaving the amperage constant is possable. And since most parts I'll be welding will be cut on my CNC table fitup will be really close after cleaning up the mill scale and cut edges. But the parts still will require good alignment, to maintain the same distance at all times, I would say it's similar to constistant long range shooting as a minor change can have major effects on bullet impacts. I have always been one to worry about the details, and I am my worst critic. (with everything in life) I grew up with it my father tought me at a young age the beauty is in the detail. (coming from a man that uses a micrometer to measure wood for carpentry projects)I will follow your advice and attempt to become a machine. I need the accuracy of CNC between my eyes and hands. I saw some mig welds done by a member here on a sand buggy, (can't remember the members name) but I think it was one of the guys you mentioned. I was amazed that's the consistency I want. (and will achieve eventually) I don't care if it takes me 100 tons of burnt up scrap and 50tons of filler I want to reach that level of a weld.Offering CNC Plasma cutting and welding projects.Follow me on facebook https://www.facebook.com/nobigdeal.fabSupport those that support WW.
Reply:I can understand the school stuff. Having your own machine will be a huge assistance there. Utilize class time to work on problem areas, learn new things and complete your "projects". Use home time to work on what you learned and gain experience.Not all instructors teach the same, and some are better than others at imparting information. I've had good instructors and bad ones over the years.One thing is to ask detailed questions in class. "How's my weld?" won't necessarily gain you much. A better question would be, "I'm having difficulties with undercut on the vertical T joint. Can you watch me run one or two, or show me what I'm doing wrong?" A good instructor can usually spot most major issues and point you in the right direction. Understand that many instructors won't be geared towards "perfect" welds. they'll be geared towards imparting the basics and moving students along. Trying to get newer welders to do things "perfect" usually discourages them, and students that don't feel they are learning don't want to come back and are disappointed in the program. A good instructor can however tailor individual instruction towards what the student is looking for, as long as he understands the students goals. Your goals probably are quite a bit higher than the average student. he'll still want to probably keep you moving since chances are this is a basic class, not an advanced one, but if he understands your needs he can work with you to get the most out of the class.Most good instructors are happy to see students who are dedicated to learning and perfecting these skills. It's a refreshing change from the average student who wants to bang things out as fast as possible and get on with things.Also some times students can help as well. They may have a better understanding of the issues you are having, since they may have just had the exact same issues and had that "Ah Ha!" moment when it all clicks. It's still fresh in their minds and they may be able to key you into things to look out for. Some instructors are a bit picky about students helping other students, because you can get as much bad information as good info.Keep practicing and good luck..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:DSW,I don't think that could have been said any more "perfect".Lincoln pro mig 180Lincoln Square Wave Tig 300/wp 20/home built water cooler Victor, Purox, Harris, O/A welding/cutting setupsVintage Craftsman drill pressVintage Craftsman/Atlas 12"x 36'' lathe7''x 12'' w/c band saw Everlast 140 st
Reply:Yeah our current instructor has been TIG welding for 44years. And it shows in his work. I have been spending time with him as there are only 3 students in my class currently. So we get plenty of one on one time. The school will also allow us to come back anytime after graduation fir the first year to "practice for a welding test"  I am planning on taking advantage of this. Not so much as an everyday thing like now but more so as a way to have another opinion as I gain better control as time goes on. I try and spend 1-2 hours a day messing arround at night in the gerage, unfortunately it's nit all arc time it's spent building my CNC plasma. But there is arc time there as well. More mig stuff, as I gotta develop and maintain the mig skills. As I plan on using mig for more structural stuff, carts, work benches, things of that nature. But I'm planning an entertainment center build for my livingroom that will be a work of art and a showpiece. It will have plasma cut doors, with frosted glass, it will have illuminated shelving, granite tops that will be a heavy quarts content and transmit light through the stone. And I'll mig all the non visible welds but all the front will be TIG welded. And I gotta get much much better before it will even get started. I'm hopeing about 6-700 more hours of arc time with a TIG I'll feel comfortable enough to attempt it. I am planning on using it to sell more furniture and will be asking a premium so it's gotta be the best work I can possibly do. Even more so than the automotive stuff I have planned, and I will not tolerate the welds I currently posted for automotive stuff. I know I can do much better.Last edited by ★ NoBigDeal Fab ★; 04-19-2012 at 11:44 PM.Offering CNC Plasma cutting and welding projects.Follow me on facebook https://www.facebook.com/nobigdeal.fabSupport those that support WW.