Need help with ESAB mig gun

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I got my hands on a 3 phase ESAB 453CV Mig welder last week (minus the gun) as part of a package deal with a ESAB heliarc 252. Is it worth keeping around and playing around with? I think I'd need a 10+ hp phase converter to be able to run it.  I figure I'm going to need to buy a phase converter anyhow at some point to run a Bridgeport mill I've been looking to get.It came with a esab dura drive 4-30 wire feeder. and the spec sheet says this about guns: C. MIG Welding Guns:Gun Master 250 Gas CooledGun Master 400 Gas CooledD. MIG Gun Adapters (NAS - North American Standard)Only Tweco #4 is supportedRather than buy an esab specific gun, is it better to just buy some other type and use an adapter? Im not sure what a tweco #4 adapter is... I keep finding tweco #4 complete guns, but no adapters. I may end up selling it, so Id rather not sink a lot into a esab branded gun. first and foremost I want to verify everything works.Also, are the torch trigger receptacles standard among manufacturers? Here's a pic of the front unit: Attached ImagesESAB Heliarc 252
Reply:If you have the contactor plug you can use any gun that takes a 2/4 Tweco. Looks like you will have to order the plug, and just hook up the the new guns two wires. All Lincoln guns from machine sizes 140 to 350 powermig will fit. Almost Thermal-arc and older Hobart take the same back-end.Esab/Lorch ET-220iEsab 160i caddyThermal LM-200 Lincoln feedersThermal Pee-Wee 85sThermal 60i- 3phase /RPC powered (Beast)Thermal Drag-gun 35CINE 1500 Klutch 140i
Reply:Best rethink the phase converter and make sure the 3 phase you can make (likely 230v 3phase) is what it wants. I have also heard that people have not had good success running welders from phase converters.
Reply:that is a modified version of the Euro or X plug that ESAB uses on most of their equipment.   the Euro connector has the gas line and the trigger connectors all inside the main plug instead of an external wire.connector.  I am guessing they made them this way to support companies that use other brand machines and torches.  just ebay search  for "tweco mig" and you will find plenty to choose from. however i think you would do better just buying a single phase machine. i was going to say keep the feeder and get a single phase power source but that whole feeder looks weird in that its 42v supply not the normal 24 or 115v which you will find is output by most CV power sourcesLast edited by soutthpaw; 08-08-2011 at 01:28 AM.Tiger Sales:  AHP Distributor    www.tigersalesco.comAHP200x; AHP 160ST; MM350P,  Spoolmatic 30A; Everlast PowerTig 185; Thermal Dynamics 60i plasma.  For Sale:  Cobra Mig 250 w/ Push-pull gun.  Lincoln Wirematic 250
Reply:Originally Posted by walkerBest rethink the phase converter and make sure the 3 phase you can make (likely 230v 3phase) is what it wants. I have also heard that people have not had good success running welders from phase converters.
Reply:It's not a modified euro plug, It's a standard 2/4 Tweco and nothing more. The 42 volt is what Lincoln uses, and also Esab.The 4-30 is a great feeder, and has many great options when teamed with a 350 mpi inverter. The contactor wire almost always have a separate plug. If not, put the Esab connector on any tweco 2/4 gun you get.Last edited by Brand X; 08-08-2011 at 09:49 AM.Esab/Lorch ET-220iEsab 160i caddyThermal LM-200 Lincoln feedersThermal Pee-Wee 85sThermal 60i- 3phase /RPC powered (Beast)Thermal Drag-gun 35CINE 1500 Klutch 140i
Reply:if u can get a power source to run that feeder then that would be a nice setup. I don't think going through a phase converter is the best option... as for what Brand X said they did fill the euro sized hole with a tweco plug connector..   I just picked up a new 450 amp 25 ft tweco end mig gun off ebay for under $60 delivered.  going to use it on the Powcon Roto-drive I have.   its not too difficult to shorten these either if you get one thats too long for your purposes.    they sell cheap cuz they are longer than most people want..  you would want a 4 roller feeder for a long gun.   the roto drive is unique in that it is like a worm drive/ high torque feeder so works well for long gun lengthsTiger Sales:  AHP Distributor    www.tigersalesco.comAHP200x; AHP 160ST; MM350P,  Spoolmatic 30A; Everlast PowerTig 185; Thermal Dynamics 60i plasma.  For Sale:  Cobra Mig 250 w/ Push-pull gun.  Lincoln Wirematic 250
Reply:Originally Posted by BlauSchuhIt will run off 230 or 460 3 phase:Primary Input Voltage & Current @ rated 100% duty cycle load230 (208)/460 vac, 60 Hz, 3 ph........................................ 74(81)/37 amps230/460/575 vac, 60 Hz, 3 ph........................................... 74/37/30 ampsthanks for the info about the gun, from the pic it looks like the trigger control is part of the main cable, but splits off and uses a separate plug (pic below). The problem is that I already have this machine and I need to at least verify that the welder and feeder work so that I can sell it or at least trade it for something else. I may end up wheeling it over to the machine shop across the way and asking them to give it a quick test.... either way I need a gun for it. not sure about the feeder... i have 20+' foot control cable that connects the welder to the feeder.
Reply:Originally Posted by soutthpawif u can get a power source to run that feeder then that would be a nice setup. I don't think going through a phase converter is the best option... as for what Brand X said they did fill the euro sized hole with a tweco plug connector..   I just picked up a new 450 amp 25 ft tweco end mig gun off ebay for under $60 delivered.  going to use it on the Powcon Roto-drive I have.   its not too difficult to shorten these either if you get one thats too long for your purposes.    they sell cheap cuz they are longer than most people want..  you would want a 4 roller feeder for a long gun.   the roto drive is unique in that it is like a worm drive/ high torque feeder so works well for long gun lengths
Reply:Originally Posted by lars66I know very little about RPC s but I think you would be looking in the 30+ HP range to get the 74 amp at 230volts input power.
Reply:Originally Posted by BlauSchuhIt's 74 amps at full 450 amps output. I'm not going to get anywhere close to that.  I'm guessing I'd need at most 35amps max input @ 230V, which is about a  8kw/11hp converter.
Reply:Mine wants about 125K to run 3ph a block and a half. Needless to say it ain't happnin.QamuIs Heg qaq law' lorvIs yInqaq puS
Reply:Originally Posted by DDA52Mine wants about 125K to run 3ph a block and a half. Needless to say it ain't happnin.
Reply:Originally Posted by lars66And I thought it was outrageos 32 years ago when the power co. wanted $8000.00 to tunnel under the road and run buried 3 phase about 175' to the new shop.
Reply:How did I do that???
Reply:Originally Posted by DDA52Mine wants about 125K to run 3ph a block and a half. Needless to say it ain't happnin.
Reply:Buy a TWECO #2 (250 AMP) or #4 (400 amp) gun.  They both have the same back end that will fit into the ESAB feeder.(NO ADAPTER NEEDED)  Best deal is to buy an Airgas Radnor by TWECO or a Praxair Prostar by TWECO or a Weldmark by TWECO.  These are the same guns but at a better price!  TWECO also sells these same mig guns under the Weldskill line.TWECO link:http://www.thermadyne.com/tweco/prod...Code=TWE611213The male switch plug you will need to attach to the torch trigger switch on the TWECO gun is a ESAB part # 2062336.  The two prong slot below where the mig gun mounts is for contact closure from the mig gun.Last edited by Heliarcman; 08-09-2011 at 11:35 PM.Syncrowave 350 LX TIGRunnerThermal Arc Power Wave 185 TSWXMT 304/12VSESAB Powercut 1500MultiMaster 260MM 200
Reply:Originally Posted by Thiel-Metal-Fabcurious what  the power company   said when u  asked   for a third line to make up 3 phase   ,       and   what   they charge for something like that
Reply:Originally Posted by HeliarcmanBuy a TWECO #2 (250 AMP) or #4 (400 amp) gun.  They both have the same back end that will fit into the ESAB feeder.(NO ADAPTER NEEDED)  Best deal is to buy an Airgas Radnor by TWECO or a Praxair Prostar by TWECO or a Weldmark by TWECO.  These are the same guns but at a better price!  TWECO also sells these same mig guns under the Weldskill line.TWECO link:http://www.thermadyne.com/tweco/prod...Code=TWE611213The male switch plug you will need to attach to the torch trigger switch on the TWECO gun is a ESAB part # 2062336.  The two prong slot below where the mig gun mounts is for contact closure from the mig gun.
Reply:The male "valise plug" can be removed from an original gun and connected to any other gun pigtail. I converted many of our ESABs to Tweco for standardization.Copy-paste from another of my posts:ESAB Tweco MIG gun conversionI'll put this here so other users will find it:We have mixed fleet of Red, Blue, and Yellow MIGs. There is great benefit to making Tweco/Tweco #4 style 400-amp guns the standard because they are tough and generic consumables save money. Various guns use the #4 backend so there are plenty of choices.The Lincoln 255 and 350s take the #4s as standard, the Miller feeders work with Tweco adapter kits, but the MM260s pose a problem. They use NAS (swaps with Tweco #4) backends but the trigger lead connection on the MIG gun has the two blade connectors positioned so they don't fit a Tweco plug.Tweco doesn't supply a premade wire, but they are very easy to make.Buy a Hubbell HBL7465V plug. (I like genuine Hubbells, they are very well made.) About 20 bucks, or unscrew the one from your ESAB cable.Buy a Tweco blade connector/cable or snip off the end you don't need from one for a different welder or feeder:"Tweco AK-354-Stock Number 2642-2400-Control Wire Assembly - Standard Kits (24”)"Airgas is my source for those, but there are plenty of ways to get Tweco parts.Install plug on Tweco cable (polarity doesn't matter), connect between gun and welder, and enjoy. This Hubbell fits many L-tec/Linde/ESAB applications past and current, including Migmaster 275.ESAB guns are very well made, but the world is full of Twecos and Tweco-style guns.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmallThe male "valise plug" can be removed from an original gun and connected to any other gun pigtail. I converted many of our ESABs to Tweco for standardization.Copy-paste from another of my posts:I'd rather buy a Hubbell plug than an ESAB plug, since they are common online and ESAB parts prices are often higher than generic electric suppliers.
Reply:That's the plug on your Esab feeder. It will wire up to the gun trigger contactor wire. Cut the end  of whatever style you end up with, and wire that one on. Only thing you have to worry about is a 2/4 Tweco back-end. Sometimes you will also need a new liner if you change from a Miller to a Tweco style. Best just find a Tweco style, and be done with it. I will post my gun tomorrow. The Lincoln guns are killer if you can find one. Don't discount Binzel either. They make some on the Radnor guns for them. Binzel Alpha 2 would be a good all around gun. You can always upgrade the swanneck to a 350 amp style if you do a lot of Spray-arc welding.Esab/Lorch ET-220iEsab 160i caddyThermal LM-200 Lincoln feedersThermal Pee-Wee 85sThermal 60i- 3phase /RPC powered (Beast)Thermal Drag-gun 35CINE 1500 Klutch 140i