gooseneck car trailer

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hey guys, i need soe input on this project idea.ive been looking for a two car goosenck trailer used for quite some time. i have ashortbed truck PAID for and dont justify going over two cars at a time. too much weight and the more axles the more profit out of my pocket.so heres my idea i see ALOT of three car wedge trailers at the auctions go really cheap damn near half the price of a new two car. i can justify spending that.  i want to keep the wedge style, cut off the top deck of the trailer and weld in a gooseneck style "tongue" and put a stop block at the top of the ramp so cars dont go off the front!!i need some input before i do this and see if anyone has done this before. all info would be helpful and greatly appreciated.Dave
Reply:heres a 42 foot three car wedge type just for referances Attached ImagesLast edited by dkatubi1987; 05-04-2012 at 10:43 AM.
Reply:A bit more background on yourself, your skills and equipment would help since you are new here.Structural welds on trailers and vehicles aren't "learning" projects, especially a structural mod with some weight behind it like you are talking about. At a bare minimum you need the ability to do code quality welds every time, in all positions, with the right equipment. The "it's ugly but it holds" type welds and a cheap 110v machines won't cut it. In most cases it's often not cost effective to do to many of these sorts of projects, unless you already have all the heavy tools and equipment to do the job, not to mention the skill set.IF ( big if in many cases, as a vast majority of those who ask these sorts of questions here lack both the skills and the equipment to do these sorts of projects) you already have the skills and equipment, there's still the issue of design and liability. Something like this isn't something you just toss together most times. There's a fair amount of engineering involved in a design like this. You also need to keep in mind the liability you are taking on if something you design and build fails and things get ugly. If you have the skills and equipment, I'd at least get a set of the preengineered trailer drawings from Norther tool or one of the other retailers, that matches what you have in mind. The $40 or so is certainly worth the money to have a proven design for the hitch mount. A better choice would be to find someone who's a licensed engineer to do the design or at least run the calcs for you..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:I fully agree with DSW:Since you can buy a used triple hauler, I would simply buy one then have the suspension modified to your needs. Simply remove the current triple suspension and install (2) 10K brake axles.However, by doing that you could be spending upwards of around $2K just to replace the axles. Last time I priced 10K brake axles they were quite expensive. It might be cheaper to just keep the triples.As far as modifying the gooseneck, again to save yourself a small fortune, I would leave it the way it is and just secure the vehicles farther down the trailer. I have seen many individuals who only pull 2 cars on a triple wedge. I think your trying to make things way over complicated than they need to be.Not to mention that without some serious skill and ability, as well as knowing what you are doing, you are opening yourself up to a world of criticism from individuals on the forum for modifying trailers. Building and fixing a 3500lb utility trailer is one thing, but modifying a 40' wedge gooseneck car hauler is a whole other matter. There is quite a bit of engineering that is involved with designing a trailer this size, and by cutting it up and changing it you could be seriously comprising the integrity of the structure. Then there is the legal aspect of modifying your own hauling equipment for highway use... I don't even want to begin on that can of worms...You need an engineer - not a backwoods fabricator who knows how to stick metal together.
Reply:I see no problem with adding some stops to prevent the cars from going more than two deep, and removing the excess materials that are there for the tires to ride on, but I wouldn't go changing the structure of the trailer.As the two before me have said, There is just to much risk. It's not risk to you that we're worried about either. It's the mother and two kids behind you, or in the oposite lane when something goes horribly wrong.I also wouldn't be to worried about the tripple axle over the double. you're only talking a couple hundred over the course of a year.Also, after you've run it a couple times and realize that a duellie is a better choice for hauling, you'll still have the trailer capable of making the added cost of the truck worth it.There are no problems. There are only solutions. It's your duty to determine the right one.Hobart Handler 210Airco 225 Amp MSM Stinger
Reply:Originally Posted by dkatubi1987hey guys,  i have ashortbed truck PAID for and dont justify going over two cars at a time. too much weight and the more axles the more profit out of my pocket.Dave
Reply:I would not put a 2 or 3 car trailer behind a 1/2 ton truck. Most short beds are 1/2 ton and dont have enought suspension of braking system for that kind of job. You can find good 1 ton trucks that you can stick a fifth wheel of a goose neck on and be a lot safer and stable. The proper power unit is as important as having a proper trailer. Its all got to work together.
Reply:Originally Posted by bhardy501I would not put a 2 or 3 car trailer behind a 1/2 ton truck. Most short beds are 1/2 ton and dont have enought suspension of braking system for that kind of job.
Reply:Originally Posted by bhardy501I would not put a 2 or 3 car trailer behind a 1/2 ton truck. Most short beds are 1/2 ton and dont have enought suspension of braking system for that kind of job. You can find good 1 ton trucks that you can stick a fifth wheel of a goose neck on and be a lot safer and stable. The proper power unit is as important as having a proper trailer. Its all got to work together.
Reply:you cant get a regular cab short bed dually.   Only crew cab short beds.Vantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:sorry guys for not putting any more details just wanted to start getting inputalthough this is just an idea to start it may become a reality soonthe reason for cutting the trailer is since my truck is a true shortbed the top deck of the trailer, when making turns the corners of the trailer would hut the corners of the cab. not good, i could buy a sliding fifth wheel hitch but there up their in price, if i were to do this project i have general skills i can do root and cap welds, fishplate, gussets and all the normal stuff needed to make it safe, and pull striaght, i will most likeley take it to a pro for all the work needed to be done, thats if i dont find one first. my truck in question is a 2006 2500 silverado ext cab shortbed duramax/allision trans, now before im knocked around i have several friends that are running these trucks with two car trailers,  but their all long beds so they dont have the need to cut anything up and reinvent.,one guy even pulls  a 4 car double stacker i have no idea how he gets away with it but he does
Reply:Originally Posted by smokin_dodgeThe Dodge Mega Cabs only come in a 4' or 6' bed, so technically it would only be a short bed pickup. You can have it stretched, but it is an  aftermarket option only, and only a few people do it.There are quite a number of hot shotters who love the short cab short bed dually trucks, with a 6' bed.
Reply:Originally Posted by dkatubi1987i could buy a sliding fifth wheel hitch but there up their in price,
Reply:I may be a little confused, you say you have the basic skill set to do the welding, but I also think you said you will take it to a profesional? After purchase price and paying for mods at a weld shop, how much will you save? I can understand however if you are not going to pull 3 cars that you don't want the additional length, at least I would not. I have never been a fan of the guys running down the highway with 3 car wedge trailers being pulled with a pickup truck , Dually or not. Anyway I think when they place the axles in realtion to the weight they have certian geometry in mind, So that's why you should enlist and engineer but I bet it will not be cheap because now you are asking him to assume the liability.    And just my opinion here, that kind of towing should be done by a 1 ton dually, it aint about what you can pull, it's about what you can stop (rapidly) under the worst conditions.    Now to simplify matters do you think you could just mod the upper corners at the hitch so they miss the cab on tight swings, maybe a 45 or greater angle. Still should be engineered.Last edited by kolot; 05-05-2012 at 10:36 AM."Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum"Lincoln Idealarc 250 AC/DCMillermatic 251   Syncrowave 300   30A spoolgunLincoln MP210Hypertherm 45(2) LN 25(2) Lincoln Weldanpower 225 CV(4) SA200   1 short hood    SA250    SAM 400
Reply:It would be cheaper to find a two car trailer.City of L.A. Structural; Manual & Semi-Automatic;"Surely there is a mine for silver, and a place where gold is refined. Iron is taken from the earth, and copper is smelted from ore."Job 28:1,2Lincoln, Miller, Victor & ISV BibleDanny
Reply:it would be cheaper if i were to buy it off ebay or craigslist, but im buying through a salvage auction,  they can be had for as little as 400 dollars guys put fifth wheel kingpins on gooseneck trailers all the time its all about what they already have. but most 3 car or over have kingpins, hance why i said i could buy a sliding fifth wheel but they take up too much bedspace and their heavy. now as for the guys that arent fans of pulling weight with 3/4 ton trucks, their arent many differences between the 2500 to 5500 series truck beside suspension, and an etra two tires on the rear, motors, transmission and rears are all the same.
Reply:Originally Posted by dkatubi1987now as for the guys that arent fans of pulling weight with 3/4 ton trucks, their arent many differences between the 2500 to 5500 series truck beside suspension, and an etra two tires on the rear, motors, transmission and rears are all the same.
Reply:Originally Posted by DSWI don't know about Dodge/ Chevy, but there's a big difference between an F 250 and F550 truck as far as transfer case and rears go, especially the rears. The rear in my F550 is a lot stouter than the one in my buddies F250 and his F350 of the same year. I can't even get a rear ratio after market less than 4:10 for the rear in the 550 and it took them 3 years to even go that low. Motor programing and tranny programs are also different than those in the smaller trucks.It also goes without saying there's a lot more braking power with the 550 than with the 250's also. It might not matter pulling, but it certainly does when it comes to stopping, not to mention all the extra rubber on the road for traction.I'll be the 1st to admit my F250's a beast as far as power is concerned, but I'll drive the 550 every time I need to drag anything with any serious weight. It won't launch off the line like the 250 will, and it sucks fuel, but it will drag trailers without any issues that would be pretty squirrelly in the 250. Put 10-12K behind the 550, and you don't even notice it's back there.
Reply:Got hassled coming back out of Maryland a few years ago. My F250 took a dump above Baltimore and we had to tow it home. Had a choice of 2 truck/trailer combos. My buddies F350 dump with the 12K flat deck equipment trailer, or his Kenworth triaxle and the 20 ton tagalong... 21' of 9-10K+  pickup on the 18' deck of the 12K trailer was pushing it, so we opted for the Kwopper. So we get hassled because  his truck/trailer is 6" over the max combined length in Md, at the scales... We eventually convinced the guy to let us slide since we had the pickup on the trailer, as a "car hauler", hence we picked up an extra 3' or so of allowable length. Asked the DOT guy what he'd have rather had us pulling with, the F350 and trailer with 6 tires on the truck, 4 on the trailer, or 14 tires on the truck with 2 extra axles/larger brakes and the 8 tires and air brakes on the 20 ton trailer.I've  grenaded a tire at 70mph even without a trailer in a 4 wheel vehicle. I have no interest in repeating the experience in one with a trailer attached.Last edited by DSW; 05-05-2012 at 10:06 PM..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Originally Posted by dkatubi1987now as for the guys that arent fans of pulling weight with 3/4 ton trucks, their arent many differences between the 2500 to 5500 series truck beside suspension, and an etra two tires on the rear, motors, transmission and rears are all the same.
Reply:Originally Posted by smokin_dodgeWhile what your saying is somewhat true - you really should do some more research into bigger trucks. A properly built 3/4 ton truck can pull as much as a 550 or respective series truck, but that is one properly equipped specifically built to pull that much weight.
Reply:I'm not sure the towing capacity, as rated by the mfgr is pertinent here.  I SAID I'M NOT SURE If you have a 11,000 gvwr truck pulling a 24,000 gvwr trailer, you have a combined gvwr of 35,000 per the law.  You need a cdl to drive it.  You can't exceed the gvwr on any one axle or combination of axles.  And it has to be able to stop in a required distance (this depends on the state I think, and it varies).  Some states have more or less requirements for trailer brakes and stopping distance..I looked in FMSCA, and couldn't find anything relevant to this particular conversation.We all know that neither set of brakes, trailer or tractor, will safely stop a tractor/trailer independantly.  If one set of brakes fails, or is REALLY improperly adjusted, it won't stop in a safe distance (forgetting spring brakes, emergency brakes, etc )I've pulled a fully loaded gooseneck, with good brakes (truck and trailer), and it's dicey at best when it comes to stopping.  I'm wondering when the Feds are gonna adress this issue??????  I'd bet the farm that the industry lobbyists are the only reason gooseneck trailers are still on the road.  They're inherantly unsafe when fully loaded.  It's right up there with allowing owners of RV's to operate without a CDL I know the manufacturers of pickups have increased braking capacity, but I'm not sure if it's federal law, or just a response to popular demand (heavier towing with larger trailers).  God Knows even a decent 1 ton really doesn't have a suspension capable of handling the sway and impact from heavily loaded gooseneck trailers without extreme caution on the part of the driver."Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammIf you have a 11,000 gvwr truck pulling a 24,000 gvwr trailer, you have a combined gvwr of 35,000 per the law.  You need a cdl to drive it.  You can't exceed the gvwr on any one axle or combination of axles.  And it has to be able to stop in a required distance (this depends on the state I think, and it varies).  Some states have more or less requirements for trailer brakes and stopping distance..I looked in FMSCA, and couldn't find anything relevant to this particular conversation.It's right up there with allowing owners of RV's to operate without a CDL
Reply:if you read the fine print towing any trailer over 10,000lbs GVW requires a CDL.   especially since its FOR commerce and its hard to convince the officer that you bought two cars from the salvage auction for personal use. Now if your not doing it for compensation you can skirt the law partially.    BUT and its a BIG BUT even a ribbon, trophy, plaque, or prize of any sort is considered compensation.As per the fed any combination of vehicles over 26,000LBs GCVW requires a CDL.  that means a trailer with 10,000lbs GVW being pulled by a truck with a 16,000 GVW requires a CDL.  another fine print item is you can not exceed the manufacturers ratings.they also have min safe axle ratings.    this applies to wreckers but can also be applied to pickups towing tag trailers, you must not have less than 50% of the unlaiden axle weight on the front axle of the tow vehicle when in tow.So if your truck has 4000 Lbs on the front axle empty and you have a big tag trailer with no weight equalizing hitch on it you have to have at least 2000lbs on the front axle with the wagon attached.states are VERY money hungry right now, here in CA they just figured out that all these new fancy F-450 pickups are over 13,000 Lbs GVW which puts them over the min limits for having to scale and register for Unified Carrier Registration in CA.    So now they have to register, pay the fees, carry a health card and put spiffy/ugly weight decals and CA# on the sides of their $60,000 pickups.A SRW pickup really shouldnt be pulling more than a 10K trailer period, but people do it anyway.Last edited by Dualie; 05-08-2012 at 11:32 PM.Vantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:Originally Posted by Dualieif you read the fine print towing any trailer over 10,000lbs GVW requires a CDL.   especially since its FOR commerce and its hard to convince the officer that you bought two cars from the salvage auction for personal use. states are VERY money hungry right now, here in CA they just figured out that all these new fancy F-450 pickups are over 13,000 Lbs GVW which puts them over the min limits for having to scale and register for Unified Carrier Registration in CA.    So now they have to register, pay the fees, carry a health card and put spiffy/ugly weight decals and CA# on the sides of their $60,000 pickups.when every dumb bro in the world bought a giant triple axle Toy hauler to haul their dirt bikes out to the desert here is when they figured it out.  Then they put two and two together and started going after the horse trailers and Travel trailers.then they figured out these supped up 1 ton F-450's were 13K Gvw+ it was all down hill from there.they can get them for about 5K+ in fines if they really want to hammer the person.  No CDL, no commerical insurance with Min liablitys, NO UCR or DOT#,  No medical card, the list goes on.Vantage 500's LN-25's, VI-400's, cobramatics, Miller migs, synch 350 LX, Powcon inverters, XMT's, 250 Ton Acurrpress 12' brake, 1/4" 10' Atlantic shear,Koikie plasma table W/ esab plasmas. marvel & hyd-mech saws, pirrana & metal muncher punches.
Reply:Originally Posted by DualieNot in the eyes of the law it isnt.   I dont care how much you modify a stock 3/4 ton it will do nothing to add to the legal GVW or GCVW
Reply:Comparing or saying that the 250 and the 550 are equally capable for towing is not something I can agree with.   Just because you rode around in an 18 wheeler for 3 years does not, in my opinion, make you a good judge of pickup trucks. I have owned and operated many, furthermore I have assembled, dissasembled and constructed many of these trucks , and their are large differences in the sizes, strengths, and capabilities of their components.  And once again, we are not talking about gear ratios and big HP, we can put those capabilities in a VW. We are talking about stopping and slowing from turnpike speed, down hills, and how these trucks react to the forces they are subjected to over the road with heavy, heavy loads.    I also suspect Geography has a lot to do with are perceptions here as many of us are from different regions, I am in the North East, Hilly and unlevel, but by no means mountain ranges, where some guys here are from areas that are as flat as can be for as far as the eye can see. Now guys in Colorado who work the mountain passes laugh at all of us. So the truck on the flat is gonna handle that heavy loads seeminly better.Last edited by kolot; 05-10-2012 at 12:04 AM."Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum"Lincoln Idealarc 250 AC/DCMillermatic 251   Syncrowave 300   30A spoolgunLincoln MP210Hypertherm 45(2) LN 25(2) Lincoln Weldanpower 225 CV(4) SA200   1 short hood    SA250    SAM 400
Reply:I never said that they were capable of pulling the same load. If that was the case then there would be no need for a 550. I too live in the northeast I live in the west side of the Appalachian mountains. Also my comment about "DRIVING" not riding around in an 18 wheeler for three years wasn't anything to do with how the pick up handle different sized loads it was about the laws concerning them. One more thing they wouldn't legally be allowed to manufacture a vehicle and say that it was capable of pulling a 19k load down the road safely if the vehicle wasn't able to do it. Remember that these manufacurers have much more money and resources than you and me and everyone else combined on this forum that they would consider r&d money where they test the very limits of these vehicles in closed road conditions but they themselves have spent millions of dollars developing these vehicles. And my 350 srw is perfectly capable of pulling the same heavy load as the same 350 in a drw setup other than the fact that the drw can split the weight over a wider stance because of the extra tires. Mine is exactly the same as the other 350's that came off the line with the same options other than having an extra set of tires. The only difference in capability of my truck to a drw is that you can carry more weight in the bed because you have more tires to support the weight. The whole thing about being able to stop good at highway speeds is why they came out with a thing called trailer brakes that aid in the vehicle being able to come to a stop. Also your extra rubber on the ground isn't gonna do **** to stop you if your brakes ( trailer brakes included ) aren't up to the task of stopping the total weight combined of the vehicle plus cargo. Trust me when I tell you as I've had my run ins with 4-wheelers cutting me off in a semi while I was empty and loaded and how many tires you got don't make a damn difference when you gotta stop its all in the vehicles braking ability and the drivers ability to brake properly to get the vehicle to a stop safely. And back to the tires you want to talk about scarey try having a steer tire blow out on you when your loaded at 80,000# and doing 70 down a mountain. Point being it don't make a difference how many tires you got when that happens it all comes down to drivers ability at that point.1973 Lincoln SA 200, Already replaced shunt coils, Idle board (SOLD)1984 Miller Dialarc 250HF, Miller water cooler, 250 AMP water cooled torch, you know the worx.
Reply:Question? You said PULLING 19K, do you mean pulling 19 or do you mean GCVWR. AKA combined truck and trailer? and you are talking about a 3/4 ton aren't you.  I don't have specs on the latest trucks out but from memory that sounds heavy for 3/4. As for DW, SRW if I remember right my truck specs actually show less GVW on a dually due to the added weight of 2 xtra tires and rims. I still stand by my opinion of dually rear in a blow out situation. I to have driven a couple of vehicles in my day.     Now let's talk about trailer brakes, sure you had the big rig with air brakes, very good proven system no question on that. But the average guy with a pickup doesn't have air brakes, agreed? The wedge trailers and goosenecks were talking about have electric brakes and they are OK at best when new, now how are they after they have been out there a while, how many guys properly maintain them or even know how, and how easy do they fail, one frayed wire, blown fuse , whatever. And they don't have a low air warining like your big rig do they? Put a few miles on them or get them hot down a hill and what happens, glazed up , right. So is that what you want me to count on. brakes that are barely adequate when new. Combined with a good truck brake system their OK at best, Rely on the electric trailer brakes, No way!    your signature says Carrolton Ohio, did someone expand the North East? last I know Ohio was pretty flat.Last edited by kolot; 05-10-2012 at 01:06 AM."Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum"Lincoln Idealarc 250 AC/DCMillermatic 251   Syncrowave 300   30A spoolgunLincoln MP210Hypertherm 45(2) LN 25(2) Lincoln Weldanpower 225 CV(4) SA200   1 short hood    SA250    SAM 400
Reply:Ohio is definately not flat for one. And yes air brakes are nice and have been proven. But they have also been proven to be faulty. Your talking about how trailer breaks can go bad with a frayed wire or blown fuse. But what about if you blow a hole in your air supply tank on your trailer or better yet the service line glad hand rubber blows out and your loaded what do you do then? How about when your slack adjusters come out of adjustment because they are getting worn out? Or you lose breaking power because you blew a maxxi? Don't think for one second that because it's on a commercial vehicle that it means its safe to go down the road. But regardless if you drive for your profession or if your doing it to take your family on a trip or if your going to work or if your going to do what the o.p. said and haul toys around for fun. You as a driver have a responsibility to pretrip your vehicle.I mean come on isn't it good practice to check the oil in your vehicle along with the other fluids at least once a week? What about the tire pressure? How often do you check that? Or I know the tread condition and depth of your tires? How about if they are cupping or bulging did you ever stop to think that just because your not in a big rig that none of the same problems can happen to you? I think you need to rethink your reasoning process because it can and does happen everyday to random people. How would you feel getting in your rig tuck without being responsible and checking it over in the morning and could have found a tie rod end that's on the verge of busting. But because you didn't pretrip your truck that morning because you were in a hurry and on your way you hit a pot hole causing the failing tie rod end to bust and sends you head on into a mini van full of children and a mother taking them to school. All this could have been prevented if you were a responsible driver and checked your vehicle out before you go down the road. ( all this is hypothetical ) my point is that no matter if you have a semi designed to pull a 100k load down the road or a pickup that's been desinged to pull 19k or more down the road it's ultimately up to you as the driver to do your part and make sure that you and your cargo whatever it may be from kids to groceries to a d9 dozer can make it down the road safely. And if you pair a 3/4 ton truck with a 3 car hauler uou should take the appropriate precautions to ensure the safety of not only yourself but the lives of those around you. These pickups are more than capable of pulling a 3 car hauler with 2 or 3 cars loaded on it safely down the road.Last edited by Tuscany; 05-10-2012 at 03:37 AM.1973 Lincoln SA 200, Already replaced shunt coils, Idle board (SOLD)1984 Miller Dialarc 250HF, Miller water cooler, 250 AMP water cooled torch, you know the worx.
Reply:I've been dealing with a ton of BS from Ford on my 550. Most of it is due to the fact way too many guys want to buy 250-350's and then crank them up to be 450-550 class trucks. I wanted to get a 350, but couldn't get Ford or the body company to put the body on  350 class chassis even though they sell almost identical units on 350 chassis on the lot. I simply could not convince them I only carry 1500-2000 lb of payload in the truck. On average the truck scales 12.5K- 13K total, even with the heavier frame, rears, tires/wheels, brakes etc. I bet almost 1K of my weight is "extra" due to the heavier chassis.  I'm convinced a ton of my issues with the truck is due to the fact the engine and tranny  programs are wrong for the weight on the truck. All the after market tunes are geared to cranking up smaller trucks, not trying to economize bigger ones. One stock answer I get from Ford was I should have gone with a 650-750 with the CAT motor.It all comes down to liability. Ford will not put the tunes in the truck for a 350 class vehicle, even though you can get 4.30 rears in a 350. My mileage is way off compared to what my buddies 350 of the same year is even adjusted for his 4.10 ratio..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:I think we have scared the OP away - how much yall wanna bet he is going to do it anyway and we will read about him in the news in a few months...
Reply:I remember when I bought this tractor last year.  Had to haul it home from Vinita.It was something I've done for years, and really didn't give it much thought even though I knew it was marginal at best.  I tend to be on the cautious side, so it worked out ok.  But I can tell you it's squirrely.  You have to pay extreme attention to keeping any sudden steering wheel movements to a minimum, the sway is incredible.  And Tulsa!!  45mph through the entire town cause it's almost impossible to do any kind of emergency stop.  It's nerve racking (wracking?) lemme tell ya Thankfully I now have the little LN9000 single axle.  I'll probably make a detachable kingpin/5th wheel thingy for the gooseneck one of these days.  It'll be a lot safer and more practical to pull with the larger truck.  The heavy loads can be pulled by a pickup/1 ton, but it guts them over time"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Originally Posted by smokin_dodgeWhile what your saying is somewhat true - you really should do some more research into bigger trucks. A properly built 3/4 ton truck can pull as much as a 550 or respective series truck, but that is one properly equipped specifically built to pull that much weight. Even then, its still not the right choice.Your stock 3/4 with a duramax is not a properly equipped towing truck. No offense but first off you dont have a commercial engine. What you have is a hotrod diesel truck that can barely get the job done, but you are sacrificing many things to have that truck.First off - if your going to be towing you need a towing engine. I am very partial to a Cummins motor, but only because ive had many different diesel trucks and in the end, my Cummins motors always outlasted any other truck. They are relatively easy to work on, have a multitude of aftermarket performance parts, and the bottom ends can hold 700hp with no problem. Then there is the commercial aspect - both the Powerstroke and Duramax are only found in medium duty trucks. Cummins is found in almost anything because it is a real diesel engine. Just look at the "Show us your rig" thread, and count how many Dodge Diesels there are.way.
Reply:For you guys that keep going on and on about brakes and not having enough stopping power:   Get some trailer brakes that work even if you have to hook up hydraulic ones!!!! You think a tractor trailer grossing out at 80K pounds is going to get stopped real fast without good trailer brakes, heck no!  I've run older 1 ton trucks hooked to vacuum over hydraulic trailer brakes that had more powerful trailer brakes than truck brakes.  Most of your weight is going to be on your trailer, that is where you need to focus a lot of your stopping power.
Reply:Originally Posted by TuscanyOhio is definately not flat for one. And yes air brakes are nice and have been proven. But they have also been proven to be faulty. Your talking about how trailer breaks can go bad with a frayed wire or blown fuse. But what about if you blow a hole in your air supply tank on your trailer or better yet the service line glad hand rubber blows out and your loaded what do you do then? How about when your slack adjusters come out of adjustment because they are getting worn out? Or you lose breaking power because you blew a maxxi? Don't think for one second that because it's on a commercial vehicle that it means its safe to go down the road. But regardless if you drive for your profession or if your doing it to take your family on a trip or if your going to work or if your going to do what the o.p. said and haul toys around for fun. You as a driver have a responsibility to pretrip your vehicle.I mean come on isn't it good practice to check the oil in your vehicle along with the other fluids at least once a week? What about the tire pressure? How often do you check that? Or I know the tread condition and depth of your tires? How about if they are cupping or bulging did you ever stop to think that just because your not in a big rig that none of the same problems can happen to you? I think you need to rethink your reasoning process because it can and does happen everyday to random people. How would you feel getting in your rig tuck without being responsible and checking it over in the morning and could have found a tie rod end that's on the verge of busting. But because you didn't pretrip your truck that morning because you were in a hurry and on your way you hit a pot hole causing the failing tie rod end to bust and sends you head on into a mini van full of children and a mother taking them to school. All this could have been prevented if you were a responsible driver and checked your vehicle out before you go down the road. ( all this is hypothetical ) my point is that no matter if you have a semi designed to pull a 100k load down the road or a pickup that's been desinged to pull 19k or more down the road it's ultimately up to you as the driver to do your part and make sure that you and your cargo whatever it may be from kids to groceries to a d9 dozer can make it down the road safely. And if you pair a 3/4 ton truck with a 3 car hauler uou should take the appropriate precautions to ensure the safety of not only yourself but the lives of those around you. These pickups are more than capable of pulling a 3 car hauler with 2 or 3 cars loaded on it safely down the road.
Reply:looks guys i didnt come here for a rant about brakes, motors, transmissions, models of trucks, who does what with what, lessons about the DOT laws, what truck is better, what motor is better, this is a WELDING WEBSITE!!! I have a class A cdl with air brake, double, triple, hazmat, and tanker endorsements. So therefore, thats not a problem, i know the DOT laws, i know the fines, police dont like it when you try and explain yourself their right your wrong OK OK OK!!!!  And to be honest most of you guys who are complaining about brakes and weight, chances are you've never driven a 100,000lb oversized permit load, even then with proper downshifting engine braking hand and foot braking doesnt stop easily. So please, stop telling me a 2500 cant stop what a 5500 can stop your obviously not properly equipped to do so then. as for motors the commercial vs consumer duramax is turned DOWN not UP my 06 6.6 has more horsepower than the commercail version (its so nimrods with a lead foot dont kill someone) i've had the ford 7.3 and that rattle can 24v cummins, and the duramax puts both of them to shame when ford and dodge both have a motor thats been out for 10 years with little problems call me. As for my original question, this is coming from a guy whos been laid off for six months with a mortgage, and two kids, with very limited funds and has a decent offer to run new cars, as well as salvage cars, but the company wants owner/operators doesnt matter what i have as long as its at least two cars. they dont care what kind of truck or trailer. DOT AND MC numbers came in already. "you guys arent going to scare me away".NOW, back to my originale question, will it ****ing work???
Reply:I believe it would work just make sure you give yourself enough clearance to clear the cab corners in sharp turns. And make sure that you have enough structural support after removing the corners of the trailer to be able to haul more weight than necessary. Make sure to have enough preparation of all weld joints and a all engineered design and properly execute the plan with precision and attention to detail. You'll be fine.1973 Lincoln SA 200, Already replaced shunt coils, Idle board (SOLD)1984 Miller Dialarc 250HF, Miller water cooler, 250 AMP water cooled torch, you know the worx.
Reply:"It sounds to me like you went out and bought a diesel truck, and to help pay for it you want to hot shot with it."sorry i didnt see this, Can you read??? the truck  is PAID for,has been paid for since 2008!!! its always good when one can make their money back on something, isnt it!!! like that commercail for quaker state motor oil i think? where all the quarters nickels and dimes fly out threw the air vents.
Reply:Originally Posted by dkatubi1987looks guys i didnt come here for a rant about brakes, motors, transmissions, models of trucks, who does what with what, lessons about the DOT laws, what truck is better, what motor is better, this is a WELDING WEBSITE!!! I have a class A cdl with air brake, double, triple, hazmat, and tanker endorsements. So therefore, thats not a problem, i know the DOT laws, i know the fines, police dont like it when you try and explain yourself their right your wrong OK OK OK!!!!  And to be honest most of you guys who are complaining about brakes and weight, chances are you've never driven a 100,000lb oversized permit load, even then with proper downshifting engine braking hand and foot braking doesnt stop easily. So please, stop telling me a 2500 cant stop what a 5500 can stop your obviously not properly equipped to do so then. as for motors the commercial vs consumer duramax is turned DOWN not UP my 06 6.6 has more horsepower than the commercail version (its so nimrods with a lead foot dont kill someone) i've had the ford 7.3 and that rattle can 24v cummins, and the duramax puts both of them to shame when ford and dodge both have a motor thats been out for 10 years with little problems call me. As for my original question, this is coming from a guy whos been laid off for six months with a mortgage, and two kids, with very limited funds and has a decent offer to run new cars, as well as salvage cars, but the company wants owner/operators doesnt matter what i have as long as its at least two cars. they dont care what kind of truck or trailer. DOT AND MC numbers came in already. "you guys arent going to scare me away".NOW, back to my originale question, will it ****ing work???
Reply:Originally Posted by dkatubi1987...so heres my idea i see ALOT of three car wedge trailers at the auctions go really cheap damn near half the price of a new two car. i can justify spending that.
Reply:Originally Posted by dkatubi1987NOW, back to my original question, will it ****ing work???
Reply:Welding capability/ability, DOT, brakes, capacities, etc aside, here's my take on the conversion/modification:I believe this type of conversion would actually work better than say a "bumper pull to goosneck conversion" in that you have more "frame" to tie back to.  Using the picture in post #2 as an example, if you were to cut the top deck off back to the begining of the truss support, remove the landing gear, and weld a gooseneck on that matched the width of the car hauler frame, you'd be able to tie back to the top platform, the vertical tube, and the bottom frame rail.  Before we start pouring over all the details on actually executing this, any progress so far? i.e. buy the trailer yet? have a gooseneck trailer willing to part with it's "neck"?MikeConstans Fides et IntegritasLincoln Weldanpower 150 ACAirco Aircomatic MIGet CAV II w/ spoolgunMillermatic 30a wirefeeder
Reply:The more this is talked about, the less I like it. And the attitude of the OP leaves some things to be asked for. You're asking for free advice and backyard engineering. some of us take trailers and anything that goes around people that have no idea the risk that they are getting into very seriously. So when we voice concerns we're warrented in doing so. There is usually a reason that something isn't easilly found on the internet. and thats usually because it's not done. If it's not done, there is a reason for it. either safety, cost, or both are the primary reasons. You're trying to reinvent the wheel. when there is no reason. I think you're going to end up spending more to modify a trailer than you would just buying the right trailer in the first place. and since cost is your main concern, you should take a step back and really look at what you're asking. Do it right, or don't do it at all. don't get upset when poeple tell you you're wrong.There are no problems. There are only solutions. It's your duty to determine the right one.Hobart Handler 210Airco 225 Amp MSM Stinger
Reply:Originally Posted by dkatubi1987looks guys i didnt come here for a rant about brakes, motors, transmissions, models of trucks, who does what with what, lessons about the DOT laws, what truck is better, what motor is better, this is a WELDING WEBSITE!!! I have a class A cdl with air brake, double, triple, hazmat, and tanker endorsements. So therefore, thats not a problem, i know the DOT laws, i know the fines, police dont like it when you try and explain yourself their right your wrong OK OK OK!!!!  And to be honest most of you guys who are complaining about brakes and weight, chances are you've never driven a 100,000lb oversized permit load, even then with proper downshifting engine braking hand and foot braking doesnt stop easily. So please, stop telling me a 2500 cant stop what a 5500 can stop your obviously not properly equipped to do so then. as for motors the commercial vs consumer duramax is turned DOWN not UP my 06 6.6 has more horsepower than the commercail version (its so nimrods with a lead foot dont kill someone) i've had the ford 7.3 and that rattle can 24v cummins, and the duramax puts both of them to shame when ford and dodge both have a motor thats been out for 10 years with little problems call me. As for my original question, this is coming from a guy whos been laid off for six months with a mortgage, and two kids, with very limited funds and has a decent offer to run new cars, as well as salvage cars, but the company wants owner/operators doesnt matter what i have as long as its at least two cars. they dont care what kind of truck or trailer. DOT AND MC numbers came in already. "you guys arent going to scare me away".NOW, back to my originale question, will it ****ing work???
Reply:guys i appreciate all the input, i realy do!!  But how many need to voice their advice on brakes, weight, dot laws ect ect when one has already done it? if i looked pissed, go back and read the first 30 some posts on this thread, and after you read all them tell me how mad you'd be if you didnt get a decent answer.One says it could work, one says it could'nt work, now theres the contradiction, im not triyng to re-invent the wheel never have, never will, not trying to be "cheap" either, and to speak of backyard engineering, half the things in america were made in someones back yard, i didnt say its was being done in my driveway, im not overhead equipped to lift a gooseneck arm in place with out renting a back hoe or forklift hence me taking it to a shop it would be done in half the time it would take me to do the conversion myself, as for the free advice why didnt i have to pay for this website then?? isnt that the whole reason for google, and yahoo?? im not blowing off advice im taking it all into consideration, the little bit i did get out of this site and all you pros
Reply:Going back to post #16 you state you can get one for maybe $400 at "salvage" auction, does that mean salvage as in damaged and therefore and inspection after you make repairs and before you register. In CT I am familiar with "Salvage Title" that's why I asked?   In summary your Main reason to shorten and go gooseneck is due to Short Bed Truck, Could you just taper the corners so they won't hit and will clear the cab.. And not sure I understand, why does the extra axle take away from your profits, Toll roads? and extra tire to wear and tear? seems minor compared to a major structure change.  I would say looking at the picture of a sample trailer that adding the gooseneck anywhere ahead of the support legs and shortening the span of that forward section of deck would probably make the trailer stronger if anything just because you are shortening the overall span of the trailer. I would opt to leave the third axle if nothing else to get the extra braking."Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum"Lincoln Idealarc 250 AC/DCMillermatic 251   Syncrowave 300   30A spoolgunLincoln MP210Hypertherm 45(2) LN 25(2) Lincoln Weldanpower 225 CV(4) SA200   1 short hood    SA250    SAM 400
Reply:Not to hijack the thread, but I'm a bit curious about towing across state lines without a CDL... I don't have a CDL, but I do tow with an 8,000 lb hitch and 2 5/16" ball and tongue rated for 8000 lb.  Perhaps you fellows can help me out so as not to get my arse fried by some state trooper who could care less of my ignorance.I have a '97 F-250 Powerstroke HD (little more GVWR on the HD... rated for 8800 lbs over the 8300 that I think the standard 250 had).So, my truck weighs in right around 7K, maybe a touch less.  I also took out the independent twin traction beam axle in the front and put in a proper Dana 60 and 1-ton F-350 front leafs like the 9300 lb GVWR rated F-350 trucks had.  I know this does nothing for my LEGAL GVWR because I haven't had the state remove my manufacturer sticker, and replace it with a state-issued sticker that verifies the increased GVWR modification after a state inspection of the modifications.I have a Mid-Atlantic 2-axle electric brake trailer rated for 8000 lbs total weight.  The trailer itself weighs in at nearly 1800 lbs, so essentially I have a 6000 lb usable load for it, and I've put some pretty big vehicles on it without exceeding that load limit.By taking my 7,000 lb truck, and adding my 1,800 lb trailer empty... have I essentially come right up to the razor's edge of my legal GVWR of 8,800 lbs?  By putting a load on the trailer, am I non-kosher with towing across state lines?Any lawful advice to stay out of the meat-grinder of the traffic court system is much appreciated, and my wallet thanks you.  If needed, I'll just have to break down and work towards getting my CDL.
Reply:Your trailer is under 10K, you should be fine anywhere that I know of. GVWR is different than GCVW,   On something like a semi trailer they are combination registered with the truck as the truck bears a lot of weight.  On a trailer under 10K they do not need to be a combo but you cannot go over the 10K on the trailer total, not just the axles. You get no credit for the weight transferred to the truck through the hitch if that makes sense.