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well, I know what the correct answer is, but I was wondering if there were any "cheats" to accomplish what I want with what I have.I am going in for a welding test at a place that uses Spray Arc, but I only have 75/25 to practice with.I was actually able to initiate spray with it using my MM252, but I had to crank the voltage to the max and quickly annihilated my thickest scrap I have to play with. spray wasn't super consistent as it was, so turning it down doesn't seam to be a real option.Any other Ideas?
Reply:Exchange your cylinder, especially if getting the jobs is important. Cheats are for people who lack knowledge and or skills and don't want to learn.
Reply:My cylinder is purchased. Leasing 1 to practice with is a rather costly proposition for someone out of work. I may do it anyways.Last edited by Groo; 12-10-2011 at 09:44 PM.
Reply:Phone a friend. Where are you located?85/15 is more like it, but you knew that.City of L.A. Structural; Manual & Semi-Automatic;"Surely there is a mine for silver, and a place where gold is refined. Iron is taken from the earth, and copper is smelted from ore."Job 28:1,2Lincoln, Miller, Victor & ISV BibleDanny
Reply:I tried it with c/25. I sure could get spray, but no control, so it was not really spray welding to me.If you want to sharpen your skills, get the right stuff including clean thick practice cupons.Real world weldin. When I grow up I want to be a tig weldor.
Reply:I did order some steel (including some 1/4") from my LWS just before I got the call. If it gets in Monday, I'll probably pick up a cylinder of 98/2 or 90/10. If not, I'll just run some beads to knock the rust off my gun technique a bit.
Reply:if you get 84/16 airgas steelmix gold you can use it for both spray and short circuit. be sure to get some HD tips and make sure they recess in the nozzle if you want them to last.Tiger Sales: AHP Distributor www.tigersalesco.comAHP200x; AHP 160ST; MM350P, Spoolmatic 30A; Everlast PowerTig 185; Thermal Dynamics 60i plasma. For Sale: Cobra Mig 250 w/ Push-pull gun. Lincoln Wirematic 250
Reply:My steel order came in, so I rented a big bottle of 90-10 ($60 for the fill + $9/month rent), and picked up a 40 lb roll of wire for good measure. Now I'll really need to get that job to pay the CC bill. I'm making digging teeth for Dad's little tractor, so at least my practice won't be too wasteful.
Reply:I played with spray a few weeks ago for the first time. I didn't think it was any big deal once I got it through my head how much you have to crank up the volts. But far as running it, its the same old thing, just control that puddle. Attached ImagesDont pay any attention to meIm just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:I was going to play with spray arc on my PM255C, but instead of renting another tank, I was thinking of feeding the two hoses from my C25 and AR tanks into a Y-manifold connected to the welder. I would then adjust the flows to read something like 25 cfh AR and 15 cfh C25 yielding around 40 cfh of 90/10 mixed. A Y-mixer is about $25. Whaddya think?Last edited by Garauld; 12-14-2011 at 09:46 PM.- "If ya can't be handsome, ya may as well be handy!" HTP Invertig 201Lincoln Power Mig 255CLincoln SP125+Thermal Dynamics Cutmaster 38
Reply:i actually just took a spray arc test using 98/2 gas but i had c25 to practice not sure about miller but the lincoln 350 i used for practice you can change the weld modes and trim burnback and all that and get really really close results not sure about the mm252 though johnmiller bobcat 250 ntsouth bend metal latheClausing verticle millrikon 17" bandsaweverlast 250exharris oxyfuel set upspeedglass AD helmet with adflo power respirator.
Reply:Originally Posted by firedup198i actually just took a spray arc test using 98/2 gas but i had c25 to practice not sure about miller but the lincoln 350 i used for practice you can change the weld modes and trim burnback and all that and get really really close results not sure about the mm252 though john
Reply:Originally Posted by soutthpawif you get 84/16 airgas steelmix gold you can use it for both spray and short circuit. be sure to get some HD tips and make sure they recess in the nozzle if you want them to last.
Reply:Originally Posted by weldgaultAny % over 15 co2, will not allow you to go into a true spray. JG
Reply:Originally Posted by soutthpawyes I know you are better informed than AIRGAS that has spend thousands of hrs and who knows how much money researching welding gas mixtures and their useshttp://www.airgas.com/documents/pdf/...20brochure.pdf Let me know when you want to come over and try out spray arc with my setup on Airgas gold..The cutoff is generally considered to be 20% CO2 not 15%
Reply:Originally Posted by weldgaulthave a patent on a Universal Shielding Gas and unless someone has changed the game, it has always . been 15%. That is why all other countries use 86/14 as a standard.
Reply:[Stargon - 90/8/2 = Ar/Co2/O2 Tri Mix My 20 yrs with Linde JGQUOTE=soutthpaw;586370]Well I am just going of multiple threads discussing it and what Airgas told me the mix was but he could be wrong too.. it could very well be 86/14. Linde had a gas years ago called Stargon. I think that was an 84/16 gas[/QUOTE]SMAW,GMAW,FCAW,GTAW,SAW,PAC/PAW/OFCand Shielding Gases. There all here. :
Reply:Originally Posted by weldgaultAny % over 15 co2, will not allow you to go into a true spray. JG
Reply:Originally Posted by GarauldI was going to play with spray arc on my PM255C, but instead of renting another tank, I was thinking of feeding the two hoses from my C25 and AR tanks into a Y-manifold connected to the welder. I would then adjust the flows to read something like 25 cfh AR and 15 cfh C25 yielding around 40 cfh of 90/10 mixed. A Y-mixer is about $25. Whaddya think?
Reply:You will get a mix, exactly what that mix is there's no real way to tell.
Reply:Garauld,You've gotten some good advice, and some poor advice from a "welding web expert" who doesn't know what he's talking about.What you're proposing (mixing gas with a Y) is a crapshoot at best. The only way to blend your own gases, with any consistency, is with a mixer. For most, it's better to just get a bottle of the mix you need to achieve a particular goal.I've said it before, and I'll say it again. There is THERE IS NO ONE MIX THAT PERFORMS BEST IN BOTH SHORT ARC AND SPRAY. They are compromises. They may yield satisfactory results (depending on application) but not optimal results.But, then again, we've got posters giving advice "because they read something on the web, or they talked to their LWS". While I don't agree with everything ol Weldgault has to say, the guy did work for Linde for years and knows his gases.The problem with the internet is that we have too many posters who lack real world experience, but throw out a lot of BS because some other rookie said it was so.Syncro 250 DX Dynasty 200 DXMM 251 w/30A SG XMT 304 w/714 Feeder & Optima PulserHH187Dialarc 250 AC/DCHypertherm PM 1250Smith, Harris, Victor O/ASmith and Thermco Gas MixersAccess to a full fab shop with CNC Plasma, Water Jet, etc.
Reply:After eating some rotten apples that fell on the ground my Springer made some "GAS" that could work in SPRAYING........LOL Have a great Christmas you guys! Miller Dynasty 350Twenty Six HammersThree Crow BarsBig Rock
Reply:Ed Craig is pretty adamant that you can in fact achieve spray transfer with C25:http://www.weldreality.com/MIG_welding_gases.htm.045 wire, 32-36V and 450 in/min. (about half way down the page)Better have a big power supply to try that. Not a lot of small shop MIGs will put out that kind of voltage at those current levels.Ed also states "MIG Gas Fact: Any global weld shop that uses the 75 Ar - 25% CO2mix, is a weld shop without weld management.". I can say that in the US its a matter of economics (C25 being readily available).I'm curious though. Other than a pure learning experience, why not just short arc it? So many people come in here asking about spray transfer with xx gas. By the time they get an answer, I suspect they would have been done with the job by the time they get the answer they didn't want...Of course its nice to have another arrow in the quiver.Con Fuse!Miller Dynasty 350Millermatic 350P-Spoolmatic 30AMiller Multimatic 200Hypertherm PowerMax 1000G3Miller Maxstar 200DX
Reply:File this under "Why Bother". I, being the inquisitive sort, hooked up my C25 mix and Argon tanks (each having an HTP floating ball flowmeter) to a Y-connector to see if I could achieve spray arc. My 255C is set up with .030 solid wire. I created a simple gas mixture spreadsheet (PM me if you want a copy) showing what my flowmeters should be reading for a given volumetric gas mixture. I was aiming for about 30 cfh of 90/10 or Ar-richer mix. As shown on the chart below, I should try to see about 18 cfh Ar and 12 cfh of C25. To make it simpler, I set the flows to read 20 cfh Ar and 10 cfh C25, right at the graduations on the meters. That should theoretically provide a 91.5/8.5 mixture. The left weld was produced with the machine set at 27.5V and 550 IPM wire speed and a large gas nozzle. It was like nirvana - no noise other than a slight hiss and no spatter. Note - the two imperfections are where the silicon popped off. Just for a comparison, I turned down the machine settings to 20V and 300 IPM (no change to gas mixtures) and ran it under short arc (right weld). Minimal spatter, but it took twice as long. If I get more work having thicker sections, I'll probably look into getting dedicated tanks of premixed gas for running in spray mode. For now, this works pretty well.- "If ya can't be handsome, ya may as well be handy!" HTP Invertig 201Lincoln Power Mig 255CLincoln SP125+Thermal Dynamics Cutmaster 38 |
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发表于 2021-8-31 23:19:55