shop build on a budget

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Hello all starting this thread because I'm to excited about my shop going up finaly! This is going to be all done on a very tight budget($2500........ish)  and full of pictures as it happens.so first  things first I ordered a 20x31 carport ....I know I know but its a full structure and roof to build on and it will be done faster and substantially cheaper than I could do it right at $1700 then I ordered my wire 170' of aluminum 0/1,0/1,1 for service to the building and 250' of 12ga romex for interior wiring all that was $260 and this weekend I'm getting a 200 amp service box with main breaker and it comes with all the breakers I need pluss all my outlets receptical boxes shop lights and bulbs that's another $275all that's left to purchase is the r panel and the tubing to make the doors front and rear wich I will do my self found r panel on sale for $1.09 a foot havent gotten it yet but its on the list .will take pictures of it when the carport goes up and I can get to work.....I SHOULD have everything ready to just put in there before that
Reply:You just going to have a dirt floor for now and maybe pour a slab later, or dirt floor forever? Or else build it on a pre-existing slab.
Reply:Well dirt floor for now but I'm building a fence for a friend at the friend price so the proceeds from that are getting my concrete poored ....I was wondering if any one would notice I left out the floor lol
Reply:Thats a great idea man, i'm in the process of doing one myself, not for a shop but just for my tractor and some impliments. Made up some clips, welded them on, hung some nailers and stained some boards and hung one side then winter stopped me. I'll finish in the spring and put in a few windows my buddys giving me. For the price, you can't beat this by a long shot. Mines 20x28 or 19x27 something like that. Good luck with your build  Attached ImagesI hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:Yeah we turned one into a chicken barn in our hatchery that's what turned me onto it I thought my partner was nuts at first but then I started figuring time and materials and it really is the way to go ....do you remember what length legs you ordered? I ordered 7' legs I think that should give me about 8 foot at the lowest point ....I hope
Reply:Originally Posted by texasrednekYeah we turned one into a chicken barn in our hatchery that's what turned me onto it I thought my partner was nuts at first but then I started figuring time and materials and it really is the way to go ....do you remember what length legs you ordered? I ordered 7' legs I think that should give me about 8 foot at the lowest point ....I hope
Reply:Looks good Welder Mike.  How does it hold up to snow load? Where did you get it?  I was thinking of buying a cover-it building but they are big money and I can do what you did with the sides from trees I have milled.
Reply:Originally Posted by texasrednekWell dirt floor for now but I'm building a fence for a friend at the friend price so the proceeds from that are getting my concrete poored ....I was wondering if any one would notice I left out the floor lol
Reply:Originally Posted by brendonvLooks good Welder Mike.  How does it hold up to snow load? Where did you get it?  I was thinking of buying a cover-it building but they are big money and I can do what you did with the sides from trees I have milled.
Reply:Originally Posted by BistineauYou didn't leave out the floor, you say it's a dirt floor right? That's still a floor of somekind. You can get them dirt cheap too. When you form up for concrete, build the forms against the outside of the runners holding the legs up and pour the slab to cover them. That way they are more anchored to the ground for when those Texas winds start kicking up. Kinda like Welder Mikes, but not quite as tall. Then just continue the slab all the way across to the other wall. That way you end up with 2-3" of concrete over them.
Reply:Given a choice, spend the money to do the floor prep before you put up the structure. It's usually a cake walk to dig and stone in an open area. It complicates things to no end and adds a ton of needless labor to wait until everything is up 1st. A good floor is only as good as the base it's on. We dug out the dirt floor of the old "shop" and stoned it all with modified and compacted it so we weren't lying in a layer of mud in the winter. Would have been a lot easier if we didn't have to deal with the walls and the roof with the equipment. We had a 12' clearance there as well vs a shorter roof like in some garages we've had to dig up the floor in.Same applies somewhat with crete.  It's a lot easier to pour the slab when things are wide open and you can reach everything with the chute on the truck vs if all the walls are up and everything has to go in with wheelbarrows. I opted to pour footings and slab at the same time on my shed for this reason. I also opted not to wet set the wall anchors in when we poured the slab, even though I had a full box of anchors for "free" that I could have used. I got a better, flatter, floor with no obstructions to screed and finish around. I saved on the fact I didn't have to have a 2nd truck come in for 2 pours, not to mention the extra labor to bring in the help for a 2nd day.It may seem like a good idea in the short run to save money, but you'll pay for it later either in a lot more work, or what it costs to pay someone to do that extra work..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:i was actually going to borrow my buddys tractor to boxblade it and was thinking about putting gravel in to level it out further.....i cant put the floor in untill i do the fence job so i cant pour before i build but it is what it is
Reply:I've got a buddy who used crushed concrete for a floor for years.  We leveled it, wet it down, and then compacted it.   200 times better than dirt and a great base for the future concrete.
Reply:i dont think 1/0 aluminum is big enough wire for a 200 amop service.  i was thinking 4/0 aluminum or 2/0 or 3/0 copper fro a 200 amp service.  i could be wrong, but you may want to check into it.
Reply:This company has a local dealer near me and they sell a full garage 20x21 with 150mph wind load rating and 12ft walls for around $6K.  They let you design a building and give you a price online.  Most steel building companies want your life history and send a salesman to your house before you get a price.I am not associated with them in any way.  I am not getting any benefit for posting this.http://www.carolinacarportsinc.com/When I have mine built I will come back and post pictures and a review if you like."G"ConductorX - The Volkswright Shophttp://volkswright.blogspot.com/http://bugwerks.blogspot.com/Miller DVI w/Spoolgun - Miller Plasma Cutter
Reply:Interesting. I have had similar thoughts. Curious to see out come. Subscribed.We are on our way to being farmers! Our site is always under construction so check back often for updates.  http://www.philosophyfarmstyle.com/
Reply:Originally Posted by HOBARTi dont think 1/0 aluminum is big enough wire for a 200 amop service.  i was thinking 4/0 aluminum or 2/0 or 3/0 copper fro a 200 amp service.  i could be wrong, but you may want to check into it.
Reply:Toolboxtavern thanks for subscribing I have come across your website before .....you better get rid of them hogs before they do real damage those things will kill and eat new born calves tear up fencing and pens they are a menace ....I feed them to my dogs when ever I can I process them my self lol cheap dog food .....edited they have real nice coral traps at tsc you could copy they are way to expensive to buyLast edited by texasrednek; 02-21-2013 at 09:03 AM.
Reply:Thanx for looking at my site.I know your right. I am going to do the C shaped trap out of livestock panels and t post and soon as I scrounge it all up. Right now they have moved on a bit since the farmers are plowing they are getting new area to root around in, but Im sure they will be back and I wanna be ready.Random images off the internet of traps I am talkin bout.We are on our way to being farmers! Our site is always under construction so check back often for updates.  http://www.philosophyfarmstyle.com/
Reply:That's prety slick right there  I like that
Reply:Millermatic 200Hobart Handler 120Victor O/A & Ramco BandsawLincoln 225 ACSnapOn AD HoodMiller XMT304/22AHypertherm Powermax 1650 G3Lincoln Idealarc DC600 w/Extreme 12 VSMiller Digital Elite "Joker"
Reply:http://www.wireandcabletogo.com/1-0-...ding-Wire.html     find direct burial ampricity   i was wrong earlier its not 249 but 215 should sufice i thinkLast edited by texasrednek; 02-22-2013 at 06:31 AM.
Reply:You sure about that 1/0 wire?  I ran 2/0 Al about 80 feet to my garage shop for a 100A panel."USMCPOP" First-born son: KIA  Iraq 1/26/05Syncrowave 250 w/ Coolmate 3Dialarc 250, Idealarc 250SP-175 +Firepower TIG 160S (gave the TA 161 STL to the son)Lincwelder AC180C (1952)Victor & Smith O/A torchesMiller spot welder
Reply:Bury it in PVC conduit or bed it top and bottom in sand. The PO of my place direct buried alum out to my large storage shed and I had to pull it all up and replace it due to rock nicks in the insulation.                                            MikeLast edited by mla2ofus; 02-22-2013 at 09:55 AM.Ol' Stonebreaker  "Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes"Hobart G-213 portableMiller 175 migMiller thunderbolt ac/dc stick Victor O/A setupMakita chop saw
Reply:Well honestly I'm just going off mfg recommendations on that site so here's hoping it works......the only thing I know about electricity is that if you can creat a controlled short you can join two pieces of metal lolHas any one used that spray foam insulation? I'm thinking next year I might put some up if its worth it....
Reply:I work for the power company here in ga. Just look at the size wire that is coming to you meter. In most cases it will be no more than 1/0 overhead wire, I know some places may have 4/0 but very few and bigger commercial buildings may have parallel 4/0 or sometimes 550 kcmil. Also putting it in pipe is good for protection but decreases its ability to pull its full amperage because ud wire needs soil contact to help regulate its temperture.  I know distance plays a role in all of this, but in real world application I have 4/0 ud  that feeds my house and from a junction panel 1/0 that feeds my wood shop and then my welding shop all total about 280 feet from meter, all numbers ran by an engineer at our company.
Reply:I think you will be fine
Reply:yay!!!! the wire is here the wire is here!! Attached Images
Reply:ok so all we are wating on now is the carport company got all the electrical hardware to day plugs boxes switches lights 4 foot t8 and bulbs i need the buiding up soi know how much r panel to buy......not a man of much patience .
Reply:Originally Posted by texasrednekHas any one used that spray foam insulation? I'm thinking next year I might put some up if its worth it....
Reply:Get a disposable painters suit and toss when one.Millermatic 200Hobart Handler 120Victor O/A & Ramco BandsawLincoln 225 ACSnapOn AD HoodMiller XMT304/22AHypertherm Powermax 1650 G3Lincoln Idealarc DC600 w/Extreme 12 VSMiller Digital Elite "Joker"
Reply:Do yourself a favor and build a spinner for that yellow NMB. As soon as you cut the straps and try to unroll it, you will have a nightmare if the roll collapses. A couple pieces of plywood and a 1/2 dozen pieces on all thread nutted on both sides of the ply will work in a pinch. If you want to unroll it, drill a center hole and run a shaft thru it. A lot of times the sparkies will set the shaft on two rungs of a ladder so they can pull wire. A couple of cinder blocks also works well. An "end" block with the notch for a basement window will usually hold the shaft pretty well if stood on end notch up.I've got a cheap factory made spinner I picked up from either Depot or Lowes years ago on clearance. It's great for 250'  coils even though it's a piece of junk. If I know I need a ton of wire for a job, I'll make sure to get the wooden spools of 1000' though as they are easier to pull wire with.  Reminds me, I need to dig out where I hid that spinner for a job coming up in the spring..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Originally Posted by DSWDo yourself a favor and build a spinner for that yellow NMB. As soon as you cut the straps and try to unroll it, you will have a nightmare if the roll collapses. A couple pieces of plywood and a 1/2 dozen pieces on all thread nutted on both sides of the ply will work in a pinch. If you want to unroll it, drill a center hole and run a shaft thru it. A lot of times the sparkies will set the shaft on two rungs of a ladder so they can pull wire. A couple of cinder blocks also works well. An "end" block with the notch for a basement window will usually hold the shaft pretty well if stood on end notch up.I've got a cheap factory made spinner I picked up from either Depot or Lowes years ago on clearance. It's great for 250'  coils even though it's a piece of junk. If I know I need a ton of wire for a job, I'll make sure to get the wooden spools of 1000' though as they are easier to pull wire with.  Reminds me, I need to dig out where I hid that spinner for a job coming up in the spring.
Reply:Also make sure to seperate your grounds and neutrals in the panel if your feeding off your house panel or second panel from meter. Leave the bonding screw out.
Reply:I live in Meridian; Not to far from Gatesville. When I moved to Meridian 25 yrs ago and built my shop (25x30) I  had only my wife to help me. We couldn't handle the fiber glass insulation in the wind so we opted to go with spray-on insulation.   Bad idea 12 yrs later it started falling off the ceiling and the doors facing south. Now it's starting to come off the walls.  Bosque Automotive in Meridian had to put up hardboard insulation to keep it from falling all over everybody and Walnut Springs Community Center (the old Lions Den) put plywood up to keep theirs from falling all over eveybody.  I only wish there was a computer or someone to give me a heads up back then.  Texas heat is too much (100/106+)  and then the moisture, spray-on just doesn't work.  Me, I would definenty put fiberglass insulation on before I put the roof on even if it was paper backed. You may or may not be interested that my shop, being so small and with so much equipment, everything but the 50 ton press is on wheels or is movable.
Reply:I appreciate it wheelman that's kindof what I was worried about was the two temperatures meeting at the tin and creating condensation and delaminating the insulation......
Reply:the carport will be here tomorow! so the work can really begin i will take pictures of it when i get homethis is like christmas eve lol i have lived on this property for the last 7 years and have wanted to put up a shop since before we closed on the property and its finnaly going to really begin tomorow
Reply:OMG! The suspense is terrible! ....LOL. Waiting pics.We are on our way to being farmers! Our site is always under construction so check back often for updates.  http://www.philosophyfarmstyle.com/
Reply:Foam insulations have changed a lot over the last 20+ years. Probably both for the good and the bad.Usually whenever I've worked a job that used them, we had someone come in and do the actual spraying. I have recently looked at a few small 2 part "homeowner" kits with the idea of keeping them in mind for smaller projects where the area doesn't rate hiring a contractor, or for "problem" areas where traditional fiberglass isn't a good option ( large cavity to fill, but limited access like happens with rim joists in basements on occasion.) We always are covering the foam with some sort of cover material however, either plywood in service areas or drywall in living spaces.There are a lot of different spray foams available. The better ones will easily out perform fiberglass hands down, giving R values of almost 2x+ what you can get with fiberglass. A 2nd benefit is that there isn't any gaps, so you have complete coverage and usually the cavity is air tight reducing drafts which accounts for more heat loss than anything else. If the company foams after you put up the 2nd "face", the foam also tends to "glue" the two panels together so they act as one large stiffer unit, much like stress skin panels.Not all foams are equal though. Many of the really "good" ones are urethane based, messy, and use some serious propellants. The latex based ones clean up easier, are less toxic, but don't provide anywhere near the strength and R value the "toxic" ones do. Latex ones also have issues with freezing in cold temps, so installation temps are more critical with them.. One advantage of the latex based foams is the fact they don't over expand, which makes them an excellent choice for around windows and doors. Older mixes would tend to bow door and window frames if used in this manner, making the door and windows hard to operate after they finished expanding..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:I don't know what I'm going to do ....got to get my prioritys in order concrete and finished walls are on the list concrete first obviously but sheet rock isn't that bad I could do the whole thing fairly inexpensively but if I'm going to put up sheet rock I may aswell insulate it ....so I was thinking the 2 part foam home kit mostly for the stifining quality as it is windy (it picks up and moves 4foot cubed wooden boxes) and after what wheel man said kindof made me nervous I don't want that crap falling on my head in a few years but dsw has a point .....must re evaluate cost benifit analysis I'm just a dumb metal worker though so good thing I have a year to figure out what I'm going to do lol
Reply:I would also use metal siding on the interior,  and Kool-Seal the rooftackleexperts.comwww.necessityjigs.comhttps://www.facebook.com/groups/mach...dingequipment/
Reply:I did insulation work about 10 yrs ago now. and we did some spray foam work. It was the heavy grade toxic stuff but it was great. The guy I was working for sucked at it though. Always overspraying the cavity so us hayboys had to go back through and cut out the extra crap that prevented the drywall/etc from going up. we used it on mobiles as a spray on roof too. basically just going over the top of the sagging leaking tin roof and spraying a 2"-3" layer of foam down then going back over it with white epoxy paint for UV protection and extra heat deterent. Once the foam was thick enough, and dry, the roof was just as solid to walk on as a regulare stick built house. I say have them spray the cavity after the walls are up that way you don't have to deal with the hassel of cutting foam back if they mess up. We did use the disposible units as well on HUD work too. basically just filling cavities  that need more than the blow in and need the gaps filled. Don't know how well it held up over the years, but it was used. not hard to do, but overspraying the cavity was always a posibility.It wont make you itch if it gets on you, but you'll end up with bald spots if you let it get in contact with hair of any kind.There are no problems. There are only solutions. It's your duty to determine the right one.Hobart Handler 210Airco 225 Amp MSM Stinger
Reply:FYI, the Do-it-yourself spray foam, big size kits like you would need, cost the same on ebay as I can have it done custom by a contractor.  I am going to be having a bunch done in the next year I think and I was quoted $2.50 a square foot for 2" of closed cell.  I am going to price around some more before biting the bullet but I can't buy the materials and do it for that price from what I've found.
Reply:Thanks for that....I never even called a contractor just figured it would be cheaper to do it myself but I bet that's what those company's that sell the DIY kits are banking on
Reply:Have someone else do it. Experience is HUGE when it comes to that stuff. it's not something that can easily be DIY. not without hours of clean up.There are no problems. There are only solutions. It's your duty to determine the right one.Hobart Handler 210Airco 225 Amp MSM Stinger
Reply:i come home from work today and had a nice new building up took them a whole hour  lol ....dont mind the goofy guy in the middle of the picture its just me  or the huge mess in the back im in the middle of tearing down my chicken barn  to put up peacock and large bird pens Attached Images
Reply:Originally Posted by jag8243Or just work off the outside of the roll. Pull off a bunch of coils from the outside of the roll and unroll. Much easier.
Reply:Nice!We are on our way to being farmers! Our site is always under construction so check back often for updates.  http://www.philosophyfarmstyle.com/
Reply:well spent the weekend putting up max rib (not r panel) and wiring the whole shop found out i realy realy hate wiring but got five lights up and 5 plugs on the wall but no power i didnt know i  needed a certian clamp to feed the service wire through so it dosent rub on the breaker box and dad wouldnt hook the lines up with out that so no true power out there yet but  made an extension chord with two male plugs to energize that line so i could see my lights on....any way here it is Attached Images