Epic Paint Fail

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Maybe not EPIC, but certainly monumental So, as y'all might of guessed, something was not going well yesterday I got my masterpiece all cleaned up, all the dingleberries removed, cleaned up with solvent, and ready to prime.Fill the gun, pull the trigger......................AND THE PIECE OF CRAP PUT OUT A HEALTHY SPRAY FOR APPROXIMATELY 20 SECONDS  After that it sorta resembled an old man taking a whiz.....punyTook it apart, cleaned the nozzle, and another 20 seconds of good spray, then back to whizzing againIt took over an hour to put some primer on the metal being as the gun was putting out so little paintI decided to make one final adjustmentIt made a real interesting pattern as it hit the scrap pile, and broke into 3 pieces.  Sorta psychedelic Literally as it left my hand, while watching it arc over to the pile, it occurred to me that my paint (actually primer) might have been a bit chunky, and was continually clogging the nozzle.  It was an old can of primer that's been sitting in the shop for about a year, half used.  I had to really stir it up to get it back to a liquid state.I guess it's off to town this morning to buy another paint gun.  AND SOME PAINT STRAINERS"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:It is bad mojo painting your .  :-)
Reply:"...AND SOME PAINT STRAINERS..."I feel your frustration, BTDT.   Preparation, preparation, preparation.... is not limited to just the item to be painted! - MondoMember, AWSLincoln ProMIG 140Lincoln AC TombstoneCraftsman Lathe 12 x 24 c1935Atlas MFC Horizontal MillCraftsman Commercial Lathe 12 x 36 c1970- - - I'll just keep on keepin' on.
Reply:Sambo...ya' gonna paint it pink for Kelly's flowers???Lincoln PrecisionTig 275Miller 251Miller DialArc 250Bridgeport millHossfeld bender & diesLogan shaperJet 14 X 40 latheSouth Bend 9" 'C'Hypertherm 900Ellis 3000 band saw21"Royersford ExcelsiorTwo shops, still too many tools.
Reply:What size nozzle on that gun?I use a 2.2 for primer and sometimes that even gets gummed up.
Reply:I stopped mixing paint a long time ago... That woulda taken like two cans of primer in rattle cans... 2x $3.77or spend all day screwing with it...[Account Abandoned 8/8/16 Please Do Not Attempt Contact Or Expect A Reply]. See you on YouTube! -ChuckE2009
Reply:Dont feel too bad Samm, I just ruined a project completely with some crap paint from TSC, The name brand was Magic. I bought ford grey, and its almost white  and it stayed wet for a week, then the rain got to it and it all sagged, now the project looks like its got giant saggy fingerprints all over it! Wanna talk about being pissed!  I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:Originally Posted by WyoRoySambo...ya' gonna paint it pink for Kelly's flowers???
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammI decided to make one final adjustment ...
Reply:Originally Posted by Fabn4FunBTDT!  MOST expensive way to buy paint ever!  And SLOW - "spend all day screwing with it"!  My last six personal projects would have taken pickup truck (maybe a dually!) full of cases of rattlecans - and probably $thousand$!!!
Reply:Originally Posted by Mikel_24Could you please elaborate a bit more?I bet that for the pro who goes throug paint and consumables like nothing... it is probably true. However for painting a few ítems once in a while, I think that the added cost of the paint, thinner for the mixture and finally all the thinner needed for a propper clean up of the gun after use... may add up too much.Mikel
Reply:Originally Posted by Fabn4FunHate to say this, but I've had real good luck with those HF $12.99 Specials! Main accessory is gallon cans full of mineral spirits, acetone, lacquer thinner and Xylol! And for the filters, those $1 "bag" style ones for the 5 gallon buckets (used by those "airless" guys) cut into little squares rubber banded over the gun cup seem to work better than the paper cones.Latest discovery - that little HF detail gun works even better!  ... for my projects.Most of my projects are square tube, 1/2" to 2", and the latest was 8' high x 10' wide.  Hang it up to spray it, the little gun allows me to turn the gun upside down (shown at minus 45*) while the cup stays upright!  Great for bottom edges down low.  The thing that really made this work for me was filtering and thinning the paint into a glass jar, then pouring 3oz into the cup without needing the filter.  AND, taking some of that clear vinyl 1/4" tubing and making a 3 foot "pigtail" or "whip" so the hose coupler and thicker air hose doesn't interfere with the gun. BTDT!  MOST expensive way to buy paint ever!  And SLOW - "spend all day screwing with it"!  My last six personal projects would have taken pickup truck (maybe a dually!) full of cases of rattlecans - and probably $thousand$!!!
Reply:Although they have their place, I don't believe a rattle can would give you this kind of result.This is the 4th coat, and not yet dry.  More of the thinner has to flash out.  I'm pretty pleased with it I guess.  It's the same YELLOOOOOOOOOW I've used on the other stuff around here.  Sherwin Williams Safety Yellow.It's an eye catcherI sorta got a thing for yellow   "Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Far as cost goes........................This stuff cost $48/gallon.  I would imagine I used a bit over 1/8 gallon or so.So you got around $6 for paint, maybe another $4 for thinner (including what it takes to clean the gun when through).  I use simple mineral spirits for thinner because I paint outside in the wind.  The mineral spirits flash slower, and maintain a wet edge longer in windy conditions.  Local NOAA shows the wind today was steady at 18mph/gusting to 24mph.  It's pretty crappy conditions to paint in.AND IT'S EVEN WORSE CONDITIONS TO MOW THE YARD IN   Gotta get the bulk of the yard mowed before K'kins comes home   I got the little tractor for her, but it seems I'm the one who has to use it  Anything for luv I guess "Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Samm,It sounds like your cup vent was plugged up.Tim Beeker.
Reply:Originally Posted by LanseI stopped mixing paint a long time ago... That woulda taken like two cans of primer in rattle cans... 2x $3.77or spend all day screwing with it...
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammAlthough they have their place, I don't believe a rattle can would give you this kind of result.This is the 4th coat, and not yet dry.  More of the thinner has to flash out.  I'm pretty pleased with it I guess.  It's the same YELLOOOOOOOOOW I've used on the other stuff around here.  Sherwin Williams Safety Yellow.It's an eye catcherI sorta got a thing for yellow
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammAlthough they have their place, I don't believe a rattle can would give you this kind of result.This is the 4th coat, and not yet dry.  More of the thinner has to flash out.  I'm pretty pleased with it I guess.  It's the same YELLOOOOOOOOOW I've used on the other stuff around here.  Sherwin Williams Safety Yellow.It's an eye catcherI sorta got a thing for yellow
Reply:Originally Posted by BD1Hey, did you trade a tractor for the car ???  Is that the wife ???? I like yellow too !!!!!!
Reply:Originally Posted by tnjindYeah right.......Many years experience talking
Reply:Originally Posted by weldermikeDont feel too bad Samm, I just ruined a project completely with some crap paint from TSC, The name brand was Magic. I bought ford grey, and its almost white  and it stayed wet for a week, then the rain got to it and it all sagged, now the project looks like its got giant saggy fingerprints all over it! Wanna talk about being pissed!
Reply:AhhhhhhhDried out nice.  After all the disappointment it's a Kodak momentAt least it looks good for one day  The rust from the stored steel will make it look like crap before long"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/
Reply:Betcha Kelly can find a better use for that Sammykins.Lincoln PrecisionTig 275Miller 251Miller DialArc 250Bridgeport millHossfeld bender & diesLogan shaperJet 14 X 40 latheSouth Bend 9" 'C'Hypertherm 900Ellis 3000 band saw21"Royersford ExcelsiorTwo shops, still too many tools.
Reply:Originally Posted by tnjindYeah right.......Many years experience talking
Reply:Got to remember, some, maybe all gravity guns have a strainer between the can and the gun.I only use hvlp, takes less paint and less air, and is cleaner, also easier to maintain.tackleexperts.comwww.necessityjigs.comhttps://www.facebook.com/groups/mach...dingequipment/
Reply:Best primer I've found for bare metal is "Flood" brand "Penetrol". As for the strainers, if you don't have any there's no use opening the paint can!!                                                    MikeOl' Stonebreaker  "Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes"Hobart G-213 portableMiller 175 migMiller thunderbolt ac/dc stick Victor O/A setupMakita chop saw
Reply:You are losing your initial burst of pressure, either from a kinked hose, an undersized compressor, or air filter.  Second guess is you have a clogged vent in your cup.  Check the cup by seeing if it sprays well without the lid.   Check the pressure by listening, or with a gauge.If it sprays good for a minute, it's one or the other, look for a kinked hose, especially if  you have a reel.
Reply:Originally Posted by Mikel_24Could you please elaborate a bit more?I bet that for the pro who goes through paint and consumables like nothing... it is probably true. However for painting a few ítems once in a while, I think that the added cost of the paint, thinner for the mixture and finally all the thinner needed for a propper clean up of the gun after use... may add up too much.Mikel
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersamm... Safety Yellow.It's an eye catcherI sorta got a thing for yellow
Reply:Ok, you all just made me change my mind... off I go to find me a paint gun....Thanks!Mikel
Reply:in a pinch for a strainer, use KKin's panty hose.  you just have to make sure she isn't in them at the time.
Reply:Originally Posted by mla2ofusBest primer I've found for bare metal is "Flood" brand "Penetrol". As for the strainers, if you don't have any there's no use opening the paint can!!                                                    Mike
Reply:....and also if it's a siphon feed the needle packing will need to be lubed with vaseline from time to time or it will sputter. I just primed about 30 pieces of 20' steel tonight and went okay with my 50 year old Craftsman gun.....only hiccup was I had a darn thread from a shop rag hanging out of the tip about 2 inches long. 90 degrees ambient with about 90% humidity tonight...whew..Years ago I borrowed a friends electric airless gun to paint my shop. Brand name was Burgess and gave me all kinds of heck. Had a filter that kept clogging, wouldn't spray, sprayed wide open, hot as heck that day, and the last straw was when I climbed up the ladder and then the quart cup fell off the gun. When I got to the ground I unplugged the 12" cord and used it to slam that SOB over and over in the ground..plastic flying everywhere. What a reliff that was.......only problem was that it's still a borrowed gunLast edited by polarred21; 06-12-2013 at 09:32 PM.
Reply:Moonrise, the reason I like it so well is I built a cart for my chopsaw and sprayed the bare metal w/ Penetrol, let it dry good and sprayed two coats of paint over it. Let it dry and harden for two weeks in the Texas summer. Hit the cart w/ the pointed end of my chipping hammer hard enough to dent the metal and the paint didn't crack or chip off. I'm not saying it's the miracle stuff but it's worked well for me on several projects.  Sorry for the hijack, Samm!!                                            MikeOl' Stonebreaker  "Experience is the name everyone gives to their mistakes"Hobart G-213 portableMiller 175 migMiller thunderbolt ac/dc stick Victor O/A setupMakita chop saw
Reply:What's really pizzing me off is Rustoleum (Tremclad up here) has phuk'd with their formula AND their new multi position spray can isn't. The god dam straw falls off when you shake it so you can only spray with the can upside down!!I've spoken to them about it a number of times and got the usual front-end blah blah blah. The clear gloss doesn't come in big cans and I think for me messing with a sprayer would be terribly inefficient with cleaning etc. I've got hundreds of empty cans sitting around. Maybe I should make a boat out of them........200amp Air Liquide MIG, Hypertherm Plasma, Harris torches, Optrel helmet, Makita angle grinders, Pre-China Delta chop saw and belt sander, Miller leathers, shop made jigs etc, North- welders backpack.
Reply:Originally Posted by farmersammI guess it's off to town this morning to buy another paint gun.  AND SOME PAINT STRAINERS
Reply:I believe that is a dual purpose gun. You can set it for pressure or siphon. It should have a tip for each. Looks like the siphon tip is on it, so make sure the paint is thinned and if there is a little valve on the side, it is set for siphon.
Reply:Originally Posted by MinnesotaDaveOk, here is the paint gun I use (and not terribly well).  It's an old craftsman from the 70's or older I got from my dad about 20 years ago.It shoots paint well - the problem is lack of patience of the operator.Would I notice an improvement with an HVLP gun like you and others use?  Or is the difference small and not a big deal?Thanks Dave J.
Reply:^Blackbart - No little valve on the side.  The pic shows the only adjuster - on the back.  But if I understand paint guns right, it's a siphon/pressure gun. (could be mistaken)Man will it shoot out product compared to a rattle can!  Stand back and hide the children ^Crabo - That little 2.3mm gun looks nice and should work for the heavy tractor paint available locally.  Do you know how small a nozzle is needed for automotive paint/primer "backyard" fixes?Dave J.Edit:  found nozzle size answer here: http://www.southernpolyurethanes.com...your%20gun.htmLast edited by MinnesotaDave; 06-13-2013 at 01:19 AM.Dave J.Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw~ Syncro 350Invertec v250-sThermal Arc 161 and 300MM210DialarcTried being normal once, didn't take....I think it was a Tuesday.
Reply:Originally Posted by MinnesotaDaveOk, here is the paint gun I use (and not terribly well).  It's an old craftsman from the 70's or older I got from my dad about 20 years ago.It shoots paint well - the problem is lack of patience of the operator.Would I notice an improvement with an HVLP gun like you and others use?  Or is the difference small and not a big deal?Thanks Dave J.
Reply:Originally Posted by MinnesotaDave^Blackbart - No little valve on the side.  The pic shows the only adjuster - on the back.  But if I understand paint guns right, it's a siphon/pressure gun. (could be mistaken)Man will it shoot out product compared to a rattle can!  Stand back and hide the children ^Crabo - That little 2.3mm gun looks nice and should work for the heavy tractor paint available locally.  Do you know how small a nozzle is needed for automotive paint/primer "backyard" fixes?Dave J.Edit:  found nozzle size answer here: http://www.southernpolyurethanes.com...your%20gun.htm
Reply:Originally Posted by polarred21This looks like just a siphon feed gun with non adjustable fan control, meaning there is no extra control knob above the one adjustment you have for the paint flow control. You would like the guns that have this extra adjustment. This allows you to change from round pattern to a fan pattern.
Reply:Originally Posted by MinnesotaDaveGot it - looks like more modern stuff would be better for me then.Thanks guys - my hijack of the thread is over farmersamm Dave J.
Reply:Lost a wp-20 torch to the same fate.Ends up it was a lose shield gas hose.Syncrowave 350Coolmate 3Millermatic 251Spoolmatic 30A
Reply:Couple of years ago, I decided to re-paint the front fenders on my Peterbilt.  It's a '91 379 extended hood, all aluminum hood and aluminum fenders.  I bought it used in 2000, and it was a really sharp looking truck.  I later found out it had been totaled and rebuilt.  Whoever rebuilt it did a excellent job putting it together, and the paint for the most part has held up well.  Cab, hood and sleeper are white, frame and front fenders red.  White has held up excellent, and frame still looks good.  Front fenders not so much... Primer was showing thru... I plan on painting the whole truck one of these days, after I remove the sleeper, so I didn't want to spend a LOT of money on paint.  SO, I sand the fenders down, and go buy some rattle cans of primer, paint and clearcoat... It really wasn't as cheap as you would think of for a "Krylon" paint job...  Anyway, I spent a complete day by the time I sanded, masked, primed, painted and clear coated.  And it really looked great...  That was a couple of years ago..  Now it looks practically as bad as it did to begin with..I really wish I had spent a few dollars more, and bought a quality automotive primer and paint.  It's not like I don't have the equipment to spray it...I have a Binks gun that is probably 30 years old, and I also have a Binks 2 1/2 gallon paint pot that goes with it that I can spray IMRON or metallic paint with.Odd thing is, we rebuilt and painted a dozer a few years ago, and in the process bought a cheapo paint gun kit from Lowes.  It came with a regular paint gun and a touch up gun, I think the whole thing with extra cups and whatever else came with it was under $50.  We just bought it so both of us could be spraying at the same time.  Sad thing is, I can't tell any difference between the Binks and the cheapo as far as operation or finish.  And I know dad payed considerably more for the Binks back in the '70s...The rattle can route may be more convienent, especially on small parts, but I just don't think the quality of finish is there...-------------------------Chemetron AC/DC 300 HFSnap-On MM300L Lincoln SP140 Lincoln AC/DC 225g Lincoln SA200 Lincoln SA200 Miller Bobcat 225GVictor torchesH&M and Mathey beveling machinesMcElroy Plastic pipe fusion
Reply:I remember when I got my first Binks #7 gun in the mid seventies.  I thought I had arrrived.  It was the Cadillac of all guns.  The problem is the Binks and any siphon gun is old technology.The Binks had about a 27% transfer rate which meant the rest of the paint went into the air as it bounced off the car and into the air and became overspray.  This was due to the high pressure needed to suck the pain up into the air stream to get it out of the gun.Even a cheap HVLP can give you a 65% percent transfer rate because of the cup being above the air stream allows the paint to fall into the air stream instead of being sucked up.  SOme of the most expensive guns can have 90-95% transfer rates.  (not all HVLP guns are gravity fed, but the best ones are)For you cheap folks, spending a little money on a HVLP gun will save you money on material costs.  When you look at how much actually get on the car vesus how much goes into the air, the savings is worth it.  Think of it this way, if you can paint a piece of 4x8 metal with a pint of paint with your old siphon gun, you can paint 2-3 more pieces of metal, with the same amount of paint, with a new HVLP gun.Air pressure makes a ton of difference.  Too much air pressure on a HVLP and you start getting bounce back and overspray every where.  That is why I like an adjuster with a gauge, on the gun and not on the other end of the hose, so I know what is going on.  I can hear and feel the difference in the air pressures, like like you can with wire speeds on a mig.  Something to help you remember which type of gun to buy is:  A siphon gun sucks and a HVLP doesn't.  Buy the gun that doesn't suck!Last edited by Crabo; 06-14-2013 at 08:05 AM.
Reply:Here's what I use. Not the cheapest by any means but made in the USA and very versatile.Sharpe Razor HVLP Spray GunMillermatic 200Hobart Handler 120Victor O/A & Ramco BandsawLincoln 225 ACSnapOn AD HoodMiller XMT304/22AHypertherm Powermax 1650 G3Lincoln Idealarc DC600 w/Extreme 12 VSMiller Digital Elite "Joker"
Reply:From what I understand, a HVLP gun wouldn't work too well outside in the wind.This is pretty windy country.  I remember looking at NOAA for my area, and the wind was steady at 18mph, gusting to 24mph on the day I painted the yellow shelf.  Wind direction usually determines what part of the yard becomes the "paint shop" for a particular day..................................................  ..................................................  .....I painted this thing, after rebuilding it, about maybe 10yrs ago.  The wind was so bad on that day I remember having to paint in about 3-4" swaths because I had to hold the gun so close to actually get the paint onto the metal.  It literally blew away if you held the gun any further away.  I probably was running about 50psi air pressure to the gun.It came out pretty nice, but I bet I used twice the amount of paint it would have taken on a calmer day"Any day above ground is a good day"http://www.farmersamm.com/