Part 1 of my current project

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This is a little storage box/ pen holder that will ultimately be part of the contraption I'll be welding to my truck interior.TIG16 GA hot rolled MSMax amps 65, mostly running 50 -55 on the pedalThe box is all outside corner jointsWelded all the joints, sanded the irregularities off, hit it with a finish "just for looks" pass running at a max of 53 amps.I'm aware of the "boogery" look of those 2 pen holder tops, that was not running enough electrode out for that particular weld, adjusted it and didn't care to file it. Hot and lazy here.Some porosity, I usually go back and hit that again and seal it up, but I was hot, out of time and wanted to put today down in the books.I'm open to any and all constructive criticism. I've got about 26 hours total TIG time,so you won't hurt my ego.If you fight long enough, you will win. The problem is it costs too damned much.- Lee Cheng
Reply:Should have put a dime in for scale.The box is made out of 6" X 3" Peices. Sides are cut to fit. Pen holders are 3 / 4 or so, I forget.SorryIf you fight long enough, you will win. The problem is it costs too damned much.- Lee Cheng
Reply:Too hot, your wire is leaving the gas zone, your not snipping your wire before restarting, need to adjusting heat/wire input as your material heats up or your getting close to a corner.
Reply:How far do you have your tungsten out? What size? Color? What cup? What size wire? Whats your gas at? Whats your travel angle?
Reply:Originally Posted by BirdHow far do you have your tungsten out? What size? Color? What cup? What size wire? Whats your gas at? Whats your travel angle?
Reply:Your setup seems right. I would personally use 1/16 tungsten and 1/16 wire but thats up to you.Also too hot doesnt always mean amps. Your wire input is off by the looks of it. Dont forget to keep your wire in your gas...go to a bigger cup if you need to. Also you need to snip the end of your wire before every restart.
Reply:Originally Posted by BirdAlso too hot doesnt always mean amps. Your wire input is off by the looks of it. Dont forget to keep your wire in your gas...go to a bigger cup if you need to. Also you need to snip the end of your wire before every restart.
Reply:Thought what was only with stainless? More wire or difference cup size? Ill answer both...Adding the wire is what cools your puddle. The general rule of thumb is 1 amp for every thousandth Could you weld that at 65 amps? Well sure...just need to make sure your wire and travel speed are up to par.Cup sizes just give you better gas coverage. Small cups help you fit in corners or tight spots. Dont use a small cup if you dont need to. At the smallest i would use an 8 for general day to day. Go bigger if you have it and have the room.Think of it this way. If you finish up your weld and pull the torch away your puddle isnt allowed to cool in argon. This usually makes it come out looking like a turd. If you let off the pedal slow and hold for 10-15 seconds after pulling the torch you get that perfect shine everyone is looking for. Big cups = more surface area that gas is reaching = more time for that puddle to cool in the gas = better welds!As for snipping the wire....you dont NEED to do it. If you ever plan on making money tig welding it would be best to cut your bad habits now. You only need to cut the grey/black end off. Nothing more. Bad gas coverage and contaminated filler wire will result in failed welds every time.
Reply:Only with stainles RE: not letting your filler rod out of the shielding cloud.Thanks for your replies.I'd take a thousand more from a thousand others, if ya'll got 'em. I like having ways in mind to do better tomorrow, and everyone has different experiences that make them good at what they do.If you fight long enough, you will win. The problem is it costs too damned much.- Lee Cheng
Reply:Its like that for all welding. Obviously its only possible to do with tig though as your the one controlling the wire. Carbon, SS, AL, inconel, are all the same. If the wire leaves your gas its bad. If you stick the wire, tungsten its bad. Stop and grind it out so you can try again.The only time you dont have to worry about that is doing titanium as its usually in a both filled with argon. Theres no way air can get to it Im sure others will chime in.Good luck!
Reply:Now that I've figured out how to resize pics on this infernal thinking box I'll take some at different points as I build the next section, and throw 'em in this thread.Some step by step stuff so you guys can throw some more opinions out there.If you fight long enough, you will win. The problem is it costs too damned much.- Lee Cheng
Reply:I'm new to TIG myself, so I don't have much advice for you. But I will say this: that extra pass "for looks" is a crutch, and the sooner you train yourself to the point where you don't have to do it, the better. I have the same policy about grinding down my stick welds. Yeah, some times I just say, "screw it," and grind them flush so they look nice, and call it a day. Or sometimes I have ground out and re-welded the joint three times and it still looks bad, and I don't want to warp the bejeesus out of the joint. But I try to stick to a policy of, "If it looks bad enough to grind it, then it's bad enough to weld it again and try to get it right." My goal is to get to a point where all my beads are good enough that I don't mind people seeing them. I once heard, "A welder who grinds his beads has something to hide!" I think the same is true of washing your TIG beads with the torch to smooth them out.Everlast PA160-STH... and that's about it!
Reply:... oh, and I think your box looks pretty nice. Obviously, there's room for improvement, but I doubt I could do any better, especially on thin stuff like that.Everlast PA160-STH... and that's about it!
Reply:The problem with that is you always think your beads look like ****. Well i do anyways....I never grind my stuff down unless stated on the sheet and i hate looking at my stuff sometimes. People come over and compliment me and im like "wtf are you talking about!?!"
Reply:Josh, I appreciate your help, and you're right about the grinding. I'm in the newbie phase here.Bird, don't do this **** in my thread. Nobody needs it. You've provided me with some tips, I'll try 'em out, let's keep it constructive. If you want to beat up on someone, go start a fight in a bar.Don't **** my threads up.If you fight long enough, you will win. The problem is it costs too damned much.- Lee Cheng
Reply:bellflower - I took bird's post to mean a person always judges their own work harsher than someone else would.  I know I do as well.I don't think he was picking a fight with anyone - unless I missed something."A man walks into a bar carrying a set of jumper cables.  The bartender says...you can stay...but just don't start anything."  Dave J.Dave J.Beware of false knowledge; it is more dangerous than ignorance. ~George Bernard Shaw~ Syncro 350Invertec v250-sThermal Arc 161 and 300MM210DialarcTried being normal once, didn't take....I think it was a Tuesday.
Reply:?? Not starting a fight with anyone. Simply stating that i always criticize my own welds way more harsh than others. Calm yourself...If i was trying to insult you im sure i would be a lot more clear about it.
Reply:Bird, I owe you an apology. I completely misread your post and the angle you were coming from.Minnesota Dave deserves an apology too, for having to show me so.Egg on my face, all the way, just misread the whole damned thing.I'll be less defensive and crazy in the future, next'll be some pics and we can get back to business.Apologies again.If you fight long enough, you will win. The problem is it costs too damned much.- Lee Cheng
Reply:Don't try to over complicate things....Bird....bellflower,You failed step #1 of tiggin.  Clean material.  Either switch to cold rolled or grind the mill scale off the hot rolled before welding.  Doing it before tacking works best.My name's not Jim....
Reply:Bellflower, you're off to a good start. Its easy to fix welding problems (a little more practice, different wire size, etc) but some people JUST CANT LEARN basic fabrication. Your box looks nice and square and everything lines up pretty well. So, theres always that.I think your biggest problem is filler wire size. 1/8" wire is HUGE for 16 gauge steel!I would have used 1/16", but only is I couldnt get some .045...A good weld is a good mixture of heat and filler metal. In order to melt that 1/8" rod "well", you'd need more heat than your 16 gauge steel can take! So, you used less heat, thus too much metal, and got "lumpy" looking welds.You need to put less metal in the equation.You can do this by adding heat (except you cant in this case, b/c of the thin material you're welding)Or...You can do this by adding a smaller volume of metal and using the same amount of heat (relatively speaking). But again, you're off to a real good start [Account Abandoned 8/8/16 Please Do Not Attempt Contact Or Expect A Reply]. See you on YouTube! -ChuckE2009
Reply:Originally Posted by LanseBellflower, you're off to a good start. Its easy to fix welding problems (a little more practice, different wire size, etc) but some people JUST CANT LEARN basic fabrication. Your box looks nice and square and everything lines up pretty well. So, theres always that.I think your biggest problem is filler wire size. 1/8" wire is HUGE for 16 gauge steel!I would have used 1/16", but only is I couldnt get some .045...A good weld is a good mixture of heat and filler metal. In order to melt that 1/8" rod "well", you'd need more heat than your 16 gauge steel can take! So, you used less heat, thus too much metal, and got "lumpy" looking welds.You need to put less metal in the equation.You can do this by adding heat (except you cant in this case, b/c of the thin material you're welding)Or...You can do this by adding a smaller volume of metal and using the same amount of heat (relatively speaking). But again, you're off to a real good start
Reply:Looking forward to seeing the results!
Reply:1/16 70s2 rod1/8 electrode out, everything else same as abovebrushedtacked both sides to counter distortionsetup of bottom paneltacked sectionsI turned my back for a second and my third hands fell in lovemore to come..If you fight long enough, you will win. The problem is it costs too damned much.- Lee Cheng
Reply:pinning a corner tackbrushed sections and sides of box left open for final squaring of cornersweldback of same weldthen I capped the day off with this knucklehead stuntIf you fight long enough, you will win. The problem is it costs too damned much.- Lee Cheng
Reply:My tacks tend to have a pimple.Do I need to back off the pedal more slowly, use more postflow, both of these, what gives?If you fight long enough, you will win. The problem is it costs too damned much.- Lee ChengOriginally Posted by bellflowerMy tacks tend to have a pimple.Do I need to back off the pedal more slowly, use more postflow, both of these, what gives?
Reply:Acetone good enough?When I've used muriatic on other projects the atmosphere rusts it instantly, then you're fighting that.If you fight long enough, you will win. The problem is it costs too damned much.- Lee Cheng
Reply:Grinder.My name's not Jim....
Reply:On 16 GA that's gonna give me some trouble as far as thickness, no?There's not a lot to grind in the first place...If you fight long enough, you will win. The problem is it costs too damned much.- Lee Cheng
Reply:Well anywayPic #2 in post #23 previous page,There's that discoloration around the included zone of the tack, now does that mean I did something wrong (postflow too short, etc.)Or is that the sort of thing ya hit with the wheel and truck right over when you make your actual pass ?Sometimes that same thing will happen when I weld, how do they call it, in backward stages or whatever to fight the distortion, it'll happen at the end of the weld, just like you see it with that tack. I hit it with the wheel 'cause I don't like including obvious garbage. Same question, asked two different ways.If you fight long enough, you will win. The problem is it costs too damned much.- Lee Cheng
Reply:Originally Posted by bellflowerThere's that discoloration around the included zone of the tack, now does that mean I did something wrong (postflow too short, etc.)
Reply:Grinder with finer-grained flap disc? You don't have to put a grinding wheel in there, you know...Everlast PA160-STH... and that's about it!
Reply:An 80 grit flap wheel is what i use...On the tacks i tend to circle out as i let off the pedal. That will get rid of the hole.
Reply:post 25 a little more filler at the end, hover and when it flows it will seal the crater..same thing for the end of a bead..general comment you are too tolerant of wrong practices..clean better..grind when you  booger the tungsten..dont cover mistakes..and get some 1/16 wire..Last edited by weldbead; 07-14-2013 at 06:19 AM.
Reply:IMO the best way to tack thin sheet metal is to just set to 150 and stomp on and off quickly(a split second) It'll give you a nice small tack. But it's all about fit-up the material has to be touching.
Reply:Originally Posted by toolboxIMO the best way to tack thin sheet metal is to just set to 150 and stomp on and off quickly(a split second) It'll give you a nice small tack. But it's all about fit-up the material has to be touching.
Reply:Good suggestions, thank you all, and for the record, there was some confusion.The wire has always been 1/16, from post one.My tungsten is 1/8th out from the cup.I'll take this stuff into consideration and hopefully have finished pics up tomorrow.Thanks againIf you fight long enough, you will win. The problem is it costs too damned much.- Lee Cheng
Reply:To avoid the cracking in your tacks first clean metal then wipe with acetone to remove grinding dust, make your tack, and circle around the tack as you slowly let's off, run some post flow and that problem should go away. Gotta clean, and clean.