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hello, all!i have zero experience with welding of any kind (shudder passes through crowd) but have tried to hone my question down to a very fine point prior to posting.looking for suggestions for entry level equipment to do tig welding on wire and thin gauge metal sculpture. i could start on steel at 1/8" (and smaller if possible? say, down to 3/32"?) but would really like to be able to make simple tack welds that will >not burn through thin or small gauge bronze<have bought some 'bare bronze' rod (not silicon bronze- according to my vendor, because he said 'bare' would be easier to work with) 3/32", 1/16" and 1/8" and would like to also be able to work with that and bronze sheet metal, though all i have now is 26gauge mild steel.. so- while reading here, i saw this post about welding brass:http://www.millerwelds.com/resources/communities/mboard/showthread.php?21886-Trying-to-weld-brass ...and learned that a flux-core wire welder is out. i know stainless steel is a bit of a different animal, but i read an 'Instructable' on sculpture, where a small SS sculpture (3/32" SS rod) was made with TIG "welder set for about 10 amps with a 1/16" electrode."you can see the 'steps' in the menu at left top, here:http://www.instructables.com/id/Bala.../step4/Fusion/as a final illustration see the following, which is close to the scale/"quality" where i'd like to start. this pc. is 19" T x 11" W x 11" D and"hand bent, twisted and assembled by welding every individual joint and hand tying"So, my question for the experienced welders here, is, isn't it too bad i can't just buy just a 10amp tig welder with a 1/16" electrode?..as if there were a machine that small! there are some small machines for jewelry tacking, but i think i meed to work lger than that. *the ability to work with differing metals is important to me though: bronze, brass, mild steel, even ?tin?, but no alum. is necessary.*where should i start?ANY assistance you might give me in starting out is fully appreciated! Thank you for your time in considering my questions. i'm in central vee-ay, btw.____________________________________________*the key to learning is to listen when you ask questions*a good 90% of what i know came though the kindness of others, when considering my lack of prior experience.Last edited by DSW; 10-09-2014 at 11:12 PM.Reason: removed image at request of OP
Reply:also, i would do this with a BernzOmatic Mapp/Oxy like all of the other newbies do, but have read people complaining of the cost of consumables and can't find much on welding or brazing bronze (and mixed metals) of this size with either straight Mapp or M/O online.. lots of posters all over the web say Mapp alone will not braze bronze, too- is this true? (apologizes for size of image - and is shamed) but.. you can see the welds!many thanks, again!
Reply:urph! it looks like some of the stamped steel pcs i want to use are as high as 22 to 18 gauge steel.. just as an added input. (my question-honing wasn't as fine as i had thought) ____________________________________________*the key to learning is to listen when you ask questions*a good 90% of what i know came though the kindnessof others, when considering my lack of prior experience.
Reply:I don't do bronze welding, but from what I remember it is usually done with AC tig, similar to alum. AC tig limits your choices, and ups you cost in general.As far as other low amp tig choices, you run into a few problems when you look at inexpensive units. 1st few go down really low. 2nd few have the capability for you to use a remote. 3rd few have high frequency start, so you can quickly and easily start your weld right where you want it. Cheap machines always sound great for new people, but most times the poor quality and lack of some functions makes them really the wrong things to be learning on. It's tough to tell if the problems are from the machine, or the welder when you don't have the experience to know which.As far as amperage, with steel, general rule of thumb is 1 amp per .001" of material. For 22 ga which my chart lists as .0299, you'd probably want a machine in roughly the 20-40 amp range. 16 ga would put you in the 50-90 amp range roughly on average, 1/8" means you need 100-140 amps, so you probably want a bit more power than you may be thinking. Machines that have a remote pedal ( or finger tip controller) allow you to set max amps and then dial it in anywhere below that setting. Inexpensive machines that don't have that option, you get whatever setting you set the machine at, and often the setting is rough at best, so if you think you are at 50, you might be say as low as 30 or maybe as high as 70 on the dial some times. Also copper based alloys and aluminum are wonderful heat sinks compared to say steel and stainless. That means you need more amps because the material wants to suck away the heat fast. Usually you set the machine at least 15-25% higher than you need, hit it with max amps to quickly get a puddle going, then use the pedal to back off as you move and the material starts to heat up.On the Oxy mapp systems, I've never been a huge fan of most of those kits. You really don't get a lot of control. They make really small oxy acetylene kits, often referred to as "Jewelers torches". You can change tip sizes to match your work and have more heat available to work with. With very small torches like these and "aircraft" torches you don't need huge cylinders. something in the 10 to 40 cf range will work depending on how big you need to work on and what size torch you have. One big advantage you might not of thought of with OA is that you can use it to spot heat and bend material, something that is tough to do with tig on average.As far as suggestions as to which machine to look at, there are several options. a used Syncrowave 180 or 200 would cover everything you are looking to do. IIRC they go down to 5 or 10 amps on the low side and have plenty of power at the top. They are also AC/DC, so that takes care of bronze as well as steel. Used expect to find those units in the $850-1400 range, depending on condition and age. I see them semi regularly in that range on CL. If you need to go less than this, some of the older transformer machines like Miller 320 or 330 A/BP's would work, but low end amperage minimums will be higher. I've seen these on CL in the $450-900 range, and the ones rebadged for Airco are often cheaper. Down side besides the low end amp issue is that they are large, and heavy, and usually want a fair amount of power, even if running on "low". New you could probably make do with Millers Diversion series, but you give up a lot of controls vs the Syncrowaves. A new Diversion will equal or exceed the cost of a nice used Syncrowave, so I don't see them as a great option myself.Drop the AC and Millers Maxstar line can often be found at decent prices below $1K used. There are also a number of newer DC only tigs on the market in roughly this range that might work. I'd avoid import machines personally that promise everything for 1/2 to 1/3 the price of name brands myself. I've seen too many customer service issues and bad machines from these guys. I'd stick with Miller, Lincoln, Hobart, Thermal arc myself.A few more general thoughts...Think hard about taking a class whether you choose to do tig or OA. When you sit down and add up what materials, gas, filler, electric and so on will cost you, not to mention the instruction, a class is usually stupid cheap. Classes in my area break down to about $11-15 per hour of class time for example. Also thin material is many times harder to work with than thicker stuff. 1/8" is usually what we teach with. 1/16" - 16 ga would be the absolute thinnest I'd start someone on with tig. Even then I'd want then to do the basic drills on thicker stuff like 14 ga or 1/8" at least until they got the basics down on heat control with the pedal. Both OA and tig give you a lot of control vs say mig. Travel speed, torch height and angle all make a huge difference and this gets magnified when you go thinner and thinner. Hence a class where you can learn why you are having issues so you don't get super frustrated. Take a class to learn the basics and then build on from there. If you have your own machine, practice between classes and spend class time working on problems and learning new stuff vs doing repetitive drills. Most instructors are more than willing to work with students that show an interest and have a specific goal. e sure to explain what your goal is since thin tig is not what the average user is aiming at. You may have to buy some thin material yourself to work with in class once you reach a certain point since not all places have material thinner than 14 ga. Also don't expect to do this for say 8-10 hours and be ready for your projects. Note: both tig and OA take time to learn well. I'd expect you to need at least 150-200 hours of good training at a minimum to be ready to think about say 1/16" stuff. Out of position welds like you will probably need to do, plus the fact you want to do thin stuff makes even that number conservative. Add Bronze to the mix and you can add a few hundred more hours possibly to the time frame. Don't be in a rush. Take it step by step in small pieces. Each skill drill builds on the last one and you want to get to the point where you no longer need to think about what you have to do and it has all become instinctive. I see a lot of people get frustrated because they want to jump to chapter 12 and skip most of the stuff before that. Then they can't understand why they are having issues when it all seems so "simple".If you are thinking used, try Searchtempest.com to help you searching CL. I usually use "welder" as my search term and sort the list manually unless I'm looking for something specific. Try and stay semi general. Simply "Syncorwave" will get you better results than using the whole model name because often people don't use the whole "Syncrowave 180" for example. That's often why "welder" works well even if you have to wade thru a ton of postings. "torch" is a good one for OA gear, and "tank" or "Cylinder" usually will help find gas cylinders.Oh in the future, it helps to resize picts before posting here. Large picts tend to get cut off, along with your text on occasion.Good luck, I hope this helps..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:super helpful! and your time is very much appreciated. i agree with your O/A bending and shaping point entirely.i sincerely hope someone does the same for you. thank you DSW, thank you. |
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发表于 2021-8-31 22:43:59