MM200 Repairs

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I started using my MM200 and noticed that the drive motor was only intermittently turning when the gun trigger was pulled.I noticed a solenoid near the top left center of the machine would arc between the contacts alot, then finally make contact and allow the motor to turn.  Eventually it turned almost always, but when I was welding, I had a few episodes where the wire seemed to stop feeding.  I did experience significant burnback to the tip that released when the tip cooled, so I'm not sure if the motor wasn't powered, or the wire just got stuck at the tip.  I did manage to lay down some nice beads with the machine though.  I'm using .030 ER70-6 at a wire speed of 52% and a setting of "1" in the high range (as recommended by the side plate)Is this solenoid issue the type of thing thats likely from non-use and will resolve itself, or should I look into investing in a solenoid now?I also noticed that I have an "8 Pack" of capacitors on my machine with space for  additional capacitors.   Would there be any benefit in adding the adding 2 more capacitors in terms of arc quality?ThanksTA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:Daune will probably chime in on this, but you might want to take a look at his thread on the replacment of his caps on his MM200.http://weldingweb.com/vbb/showthread.php?t=39389.No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Thanks DSW.  Great link.What about that motor solenoid?TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:Some Bead Pics TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:Looks like a bit of undercut on the topside.  Gun angle and speed should correct it.I wouldn't worry about adding a couple more capacitors as the designed total capacitance is sufficient.  If your settings are as recommended for the wire and material in question as stated, heat looks to be adequate which tells me the current caps are OK.You may want to go ahead and replace the welding contactor control relay CR1 which should be the one from which you're seeing the arcing.  At the very least, you should be able to remove the relay cover and attempt to clean the contacts but there's no telling how long that "fix" will last.MM200 w/Spoolmatic 1Syncrowave 180SDBobcat 225G Plus - LP/NGMUTT Suitcase WirefeederWC-1S/Spoolmatic 1HF-251D-1PakMaster 100XL '68 Red Face Code #6633 projectStar Jet 21-110Save Second Base!
Reply:Thanks again.TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:Duane,My machine falls somewhere between th manual you sent me the link for, and the one from the miller website.  Mine has 8 capacitors, but a 4 pin plug for the Spoolmatic.  CR1 is around $54 from Miller for less.  I want to make sure I have the right PN.  The area I saw all the contact arcing and heard all the noise from is top center, attached to the sub panel sticking out towards you, and directly above the blue Capacitor.Trying to post pic, tough from iPad.Last edited by Drf255; 09-06-2011 at 06:38 AM.TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:That's CR1 BUT if your machine is a 200/230V input voltage unit, the input power strip is jumpered for 200V which would explain the 55V output at the spoolgun receptacle.However, if it's a 230/460V unit, it's jumpered correctly for 230V.  The input voltage rating is listed on the faceplate.Being the earlier open contact design as opposed to an enclosed relay, you shoould be able to clean up the pionts of CR1 to see if that corrects the problem before investing in a new unit.To assure getting the correct manual, get the SN off the faceplate of the machine and use it to download the SN based document here http://www.millerwelds.com/service/o...uals.php?model for your second generation MM200.MM200 w/Spoolmatic 1Syncrowave 180SDBobcat 225G Plus - LP/NGMUTT Suitcase WirefeederWC-1S/Spoolmatic 1HF-251D-1PakMaster 100XL '68 Red Face Code #6633 projectStar Jet 21-110Save Second Base!
Reply:MM2ooo is the best, but after it broken, it difficult to fix
Reply:How do I tell if its 200?230 machine?It's fitted with a factory Plug, so Im assuming its a 200 machine.  Where would I find this out and the jumper info?  I get 240V from my outlet.TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:Take a pict of the face plate and post it up. As Duanne said, it should tell you whether it's a 200/230v unit or a 230/460v unit. Plate is often on the back and is usually silver in color. If nothing else, post good detailed picts of the front and back and we can tell you what we need better picts of..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:There is no plate on mine, front or back.  My serial number is engraved on the front panel of the unit, and by memory, it is only the SN and no other designation as I've seen on plates in other welders.  It does have the wire diagram inside the wrapper.  I will look closely at this.  IIRC, that usually shows where to install the jumper.TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:I think that the full serial number can be looked up by a technician at Miller who can tell which voltages your machine is designed to run on. I thought Miller had an 800 number, but I only see a regular phone number on the website right now.According to the manual, there is supposed to be a diagram above the input terminal plate, of the different jumper linkages; when I got my used machine, the diagram was missing as yours is, per your picture. The linkage for different voltages also isn't shown in the manual.
Reply:Originally Posted by duaneb55That's CR1 BUT if your machine is a 200/230V input voltage unit, the input power strip is jumpered for 200V which would explain the 55V output at the spoolgun receptacle.However, if it's a 230/460V unit, it's jumpered correctly for 230V.  The input voltage rating is listed on the faceplate.Being the earlier open contact design as opposed to an enclosed relay, you shoould be able to clean up the pionts of CR1 to see if that corrects the problem before investing in a new unit.To assure getting the correct manual, get the SN off the faceplate of the machine and use it to download the SN based document here http://www.millerwelds.com/service/o...uals.php?model for your second generation MM200.
Reply:Originally Posted by Drf255It is a 200/230 input machine. What is the proper jumper position for a 240 volt input?
Reply:JD708216Thanks againTA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:Originally Posted by Drf255JD708216Thanks again
Reply:Still having the same problem, even after cleaning the points.  When I start the machine up after an extended time off, the wire gets power, but the rollers don't turn.  If I keep holding the trigger, the wheels eventually intermittently turn, then turn almost always.  It's like the more I use the machine, the more consistent they get.   Is this definitely CR1?Is there any way it's the motor, or would that be an all or none kinda thing?can I replace my old style CR1 with a plug in new style piece, or do I need to use the old style?   Thanks againNaStyer all that work, I'm kinda disappointed it's not working perfectly.TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:Should read "Thanks again. After all that work...". The CR1 in the manual for my machine is listed as "24V Relay Kit" whereas the new relay is listed as just the relay.  I'm wondering if the "kit" part includes the part to change to the newer relay.  The kit is $75 at Miller4less.TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:I thought nothing ever went wrong with these machines. Had this been a chinese machine, we would have seen the usual comments from the usual suspects.
Reply:Originally Posted by LlundbergI thought nothing ever went wrong with these machines. Had this been a chinese machine, we would have seen the usual comments from the usual suspects.
Reply:Originally Posted by duaneb55Seriously?!  Who ever said "nothing ever went wrong with these machines".  Practically bulletproof yes but it's still a machine and a 28 year old one at that.  Let's see how many Chinese units built today are still around and running in 2039.  Does that cover your "usual comments from the usual suspects." adequately?.
Reply:Originally Posted by duaneb55Seriously?!  Who ever said "nothing ever went wrong with these machines".  Practically bulletproof yes but it's still a machine and a 28 year old one
Reply:Sorry, forgot to clarify on the relay kit.I'll check back.MM200 w/Spoolmatic 1Syncrowave 180SDBobcat 225G Plus - LP/NGMUTT Suitcase WirefeederWC-1S/Spoolmatic 1HF-251D-1PakMaster 100XL '68 Red Face Code #6633 projectStar Jet 21-110Save Second Base!Llundberg, you have to understand that the types of "import" machines we get here in the US is probably a lot different than what you see there in the land of Oz. The imports we get that everyone is griping about are the ones where low cost is the #1 factor. No one is complaining about companies like Kempi.  The Canuks seem to have more of those then us in the US. The ones that are the issues are usually the inexpensive units that seem to all be the same and sold by various "retailers", usually with very dubious sales practices.The Op has a near 30 year old machine and the company is not only willing to  help with his product to repair an issue, they stock a part that will do the job!  How many guys have reported they've waited months to get something as simple as anew cover for a current production import here? Almost no one reports their new Miller or lincoln died within days ( or even the 1st time they powered it up). The very few who do have an issue, it usually gets resolved very quickly with no need to resort to  showing the whole world how poor the companies customer service is or the company holding the new owner hostage unless the thread is deleted or a retraction is made.I can understand why you might have a dislike for the anti-import crowd. The threads get pretty ugly.  Keep in mind that these situations need people on both sides to get ugly. You are acting almost as bad as some of them at least right now. Remeber that a good portion of the people who dislike these cheap imports have an honest belief that they need to show those who haven't a clue, that many of these machines have serious issues. The retailers ( and many so called "posters" who actually work for the retailers) try their very best to bury, hide and lay as much of a smoke screen as possible to cover the actual issues that are out there with the machines and how poorly their customer service is when there actually are problems. The guys here who know better just want to not see people waste their hard earned money on some snake oil salesman and his "miracle" machine..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:So i opened the machine tonight.  Before starting the task of clipping the ties that hold the wire connectors, I decided to look at CR1 a bit closer.My open contact type has a solenoid that makes 2 points contact when energized.  Im assuming one is the motor, and one the weld circuit.  One of the 2 appeared to have an excessive gap.  I cleaned the contacts again and slightly bent the points back into place so the gaps were equal.The machine is now working perfectly.  Thanks so much again.TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:Well there you go.  Good job. If it acts up again, I'd consider replacing it so it doesn't die in the middle of a project but at least now you're aware of it and know what to do should that happen.MM200 w/Spoolmatic 1Syncrowave 180SDBobcat 225G Plus - LP/NGMUTT Suitcase WirefeederWC-1S/Spoolmatic 1HF-251D-1PakMaster 100XL '68 Red Face Code #6633 projectStar Jet 21-110Save Second Base!
Reply:Thanks again.  One more question (if you don't mind), how do you secure a 4" roll of wire in this machine?  Is there some type of adapter available, or do you just slide it onto the threaded rod and make a spacer out of pipe for it, then reinstall the spring and nut?TA Arcmaster 300CM3XMT 304S22P12 suitcase feederX-Treme 12VSOptima pulserTA161SMaxstar 150STLHypertherm PM45OP setupStihl 020AVP, 039, 066 Magnum
Reply:My friend who operates a professional CNC machine shop also does welding. He has a Millermatic 200 that he bought new something like 30 years ago and it's still running nicely. The 200 was a great unit. I wish they were still making them so I could have bought one. I had to make do with a new Millermatic 252. In some areas of the world I'm aware that it's difficult to get Miller and Lincoln. There is also shipping, VAT and Customs to deal with so it's not surprising that Chinese units are more common. That's the way it goes.Miller Millermatic 252Miller Syncrowave 200Liincoln AC-DC 225Victor O-A Set