tig -what filler rod if I dont know type ss

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HiI have to fix some brackets (tacks) on a Stainless Steel heat shield for my motorcycle. I heard that you have to match the filler rod with the type of Stainless. Since i don't know it, would 316 be ok.Mike
Reply:309 is a good choice.Regards,RobGreat Basin WeldingInstagramBlue weldersRed weldersMy luscious Table DIY TIG Torch cooler
Reply:I agree...if your part is 304L you'd want to use a 308L filler. 309L is a good choice as it will weld good with a wide range or stainless and steels since you really don't know the grade or quality.AWS 17.1, D1.1 and ASME IX (GTAW)Miller Syncrowave 350LX, Maxstar 150sth, Maxstar 200DX and  Millermatic 252 w/ Spoolmatic 30aMiller buzz box with Lincolin TombstoneThermal Dynamics Cutmaster 38
Reply:309L or 312L are both good filler metal choices when you're working with an unknown grade of stainless steel.  Make sure you clean and de-grease the area being welded thoroughly.  Rust, road salt, or grease/oil are all bad for stainless welding.  If you don't get all foreign contaminants cleaned up, you may have weld [hot] cracking issues or poor corrosion resistance in the finished weld and surrounding heat affected zone.Benson's Mobile Welding - Dayton, OH metro area - AWS Certified Welding Inspector
Reply:ThanksI'll start looking for 309L or 312LI may not need a filler rod since I'm only tacking, but I like to have it in my hand just incaseMike
Reply:You can also grab some 309l stick rods and clean the coating off works just fine and might be easier to find.AWS 17.1, D1.1 and ASME IX (GTAW)Miller Syncrowave 350LX, Maxstar 150sth, Maxstar 200DX and  Millermatic 252 w/ Spoolmatic 30aMiller buzz box with Lincolin TombstoneThermal Dynamics Cutmaster 38
Reply:Rick, your reply made me curious, so I emailed an acquaintance that works for Hobart in the stick electrode manufacturing plant.  Hobart 309L stick rods are made using 304L stainless steel rod.  The extra alloying ingredients needed to make the weld deposit chemistry for  309L are in the flux coating, and become part of the weld metal as the rod burns off.So, at least with Hobart rods, if you're knocking the flux off of them and using the bare rod for filler metal, you're welding with 304L filler material.  This might work, but might also have undesirable outcome(cracking) depending on what the base metal is, and how much dilution there is between the filler metal and the base metal.Not knowing what the base metal is, makes the whole thing a crap shoot.  But starting with real 309L or 312L filler metal makes your odds better, I think.  The OP's original question was about a heat shield on a motorcycle exhaust.  Probably not a really critical part; unless it falls off while the bike is moving.Just some food for thought... Originally Posted by Rick_HYou can also grab some 309l stick rods and clean the coating off works just fine and might be easier to find.
Reply:Originally Posted by newtoweldingThanksI'll start looking for 309L or 312LI may not need a filler rod since I'm only tacking, but I like to have it in my hand just incaseMike
Reply:Good  pointI'll try the "sample" approach and get filler rod.  I don't want the tacks to brake again.Mike
Reply:316 is completely fine for what you're doing. Don't go looking for new rod, just weld it. 308 is fine too since the heat shield is almost certainly 304.Welding/Fab Pics: www.UtahWeld.com
Reply:Why is it a problem to use 316 filler on 304?ESAB has a stick rod OK 63.20 that I used a little for stainless. They say it's fine for both 304 and 316 and then some.http://www.oilandgasproductnews.com/...peline-weldingLooking at the classification on the rod it says E316L-16. So I assume that means that it is 316L?Anyway, maybe rods and filler can't be compared that way. I don't know, just trying to learn what happens when you use 316 filler on 304
Reply:Originally Posted by A_DAB_will_doRick, your reply made me curious, so I emailed an acquaintance that works for Hobart in the stick electrode manufacturing plant.  Hobart 309L stick rods are made using 304L stainless steel rod.  The extra alloying ingredients needed to make the weld deposit chemistry for  309L are in the flux coating, and become part of the weld metal as the rod burns off.So, at least with Hobart rods, if you're knocking the flux off of them and using the bare rod for filler metal, you're welding with 304L filler material.  This might work, but might also have undesirable outcome(cracking) depending on what the base metal is, and how much dilution there is between the filler metal and the base metal.Not knowing what the base metal is, makes the whole thing a crap shoot.  But starting with real 309L or 312L filler metal makes your odds better, I think.  The OP's original question was about a heat shield on a motorcycle exhaust.  Probably not a really critical part; unless it falls off while the bike is moving.Just some food for thought...
Reply:Originally Posted by Pete.S.Why is it a problem to use 316 filler on 304?ESAB has a stick rod OK 63.20 that I used a little for stainless. They say it's fine for both 304 and 316 and then some.http://www.oilandgasproductnews.com/...peline-weldingLooking at the classification on the rod it says E316L-16. So I assume that means that it is 316L?Anyway, maybe rods and filler can't be compared that way. I don't know, just trying to learn what happens when you use 316 filler on 304
Reply:Originally Posted by Pete.S.Why is it a problem to use 316 filler on 304?ESAB has a stick rod OK 63.20 that I used a little for stainless. They say it's fine for both 304 and 316 and then some.http://www.oilandgasproductnews.com/...peline-weldingLooking at the classification on the rod it says E316L-16. So I assume that means that it is 316L?Anyway, maybe rods and filler can't be compared that way. I don't know, just trying to learn what happens when you use 316 filler on 304
Reply:LIncoln has a good video on dissimilar metal welds and repairing/modifying tools using stainless filler metal312L and 309L are my go-to products when I don't know exactly what I'm welding or I know I'm welding two different grades of steel(stainless to mild) together.  312 stainless filler rod has been marketed as maintenance rod for years...Super Missileweld, Certainium 707, and I'm sure some other brand names.  In my experience, fancy names carry expensive price tags.  Think of asking for 312SS filler as the same as asking for the store brand or generic brand. 312 has really high strength and really good resistance to cracking.  It won't work miracles (despite claims to the contrary), but when joining stainless anything else unknown, it's a safe choice.316L is generally OK for welding 304L, but it's more expensive than 308L; the standard recommended product.  316L has molybdenum added to the weld metal. Helps the weld retain strength at  high temperatures and also improves resistance to stress corrosion cracking and pitting corrosion; common in chlorine-rich (including saltwater) environments.  This is why you see 316 piping used in marine environments or in food/pharma piping; where they sometimes clean and sterilize with chlorine-containing chemicals. 316 resists corrosion better.  But, molybdenum can also encourage cracking under certain conditions; which is why it's not always the best choice.For a one-off job, the cost difference between 304L and 316L isn't an issue. But I wouldn't get in the habit of using 316L all the time because of the cost.In this particular case, we don't actually know what the stainless steel motorcycle heat shield is made of.  I've seen some posts guessing or assuming  that the motorcycle heat shield is made from 304L.  In my experience vehicle components, particularly OEM parts, are often 409L stainless.  (If they're stainless at all and not aluminized mild steel.) 409L is the cheapest grade of stainless available. Top shelf aftermarket parts are often made of 304L because it is a higher quality, more durable material in most applications.    The OP wasn't real specific about what tack welds he was repairing, and if they were SS to SS or SS to mild steel.  So I figured a filler rod suitable for a dissimilar metal weld was a safer bet.  This is my reason for recommending 309L or 312L.If the heat shield and the other side of the weld joint are 304L, then using 308L or 316L should work fine....   Originally Posted by shovelonI was taught long ago that 316L is fine to use on 304/304L, but not 304/304L on 316/316L. I don't have any documentation for or against the practice. Your link does shed some light on it. I did buy some linclone all purpose SS filler years ago recommended for all 300 series repairs. I think it turned out to be 316L.
Reply:Originally Posted by A_DAB_will_do312L and 309L are my go-to products when I don't know exactly what I'm welding or I know I'm welding two different grades of steel(stainless to mild) together.  312 stainless filler rod has been marketed as maintenance rod for years...Super Missileweld, Certainium 707, and I'm sure some other brand names.  In my experience, fancy names carry expensive price tags.  Think of asking for 312SS filler as the same as asking for the store brand or generic brand. 312 has really high strength and really good resistance to cracking.  It won't work miracles (despite claims to the contrary), but when joining stainless anything else unknown, it's a safe choice.