Gouging with a powermax 800

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I am starting to have a fairly frequent need to do some light to medium duty gouging, lots of crack repair and weld removal.  My only option right now is my Bobcat 250, I have an air arc setup for but I know it's not good for the machine and I kind of depend on that thing for my income.  So I have the opportunity to buy a Hypertherm Powermax 800 for $500, but I've never ran one and don't know how it would handle gouging.  I used to have a Powermax 45 at my old job and loved it, but I think it would be pretty slow going when it came time to cut the shank off of an excavator bucket or something like that.  Anyone have experience with a Powermax 800??
Reply:I don’t have any experience with the Powermax 800. I have a Powermax 1250. It is fun to scarf out welds with. Kind of like laser surgery. But don’t kid your self, it’s not going to remove iron like a 400-amp welder and 1/4” carbons. No way! Attached ImagesDon’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:Oh I don't expect it to compete with that, and I don't really need it to.  I mainly need to remove welds and gouge out cracks for repair.  I know the best solution would be a 400+amp welder, but I don't have that and won't be upgrading for another year.  So for now I was hoping to get by with a plasma gouging setup of I can get it for that cheap and it would do the job.  Eventually I would like to get a Powermax 85, but that will also be a down the road purchase.
Reply:Here's a one pass back gouge using a 3/8" carbon and 500 amps.   Took me around 2.5 hrs. to go all the way down a 55' long seam.    I did that 4 times this past week.
Reply:The plasma cutter may get you by on small tasks. You could always rent a big diesel drive welder when you have to really move some iron.Don’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:I've thought about that option, but since I'm planning on a plasma cutter eventually, I was hoping the 800 would be a good option
Reply:We have the 1250 at work and it works ok for gouging, hard to get into some spots and your hand is pretty close to the action. For $500 I'd be all over it
Reply:Originally Posted by Firemanmike69We have the 1250 at work and it works ok for gouging, hard to get into some spots and your hand is pretty close to the action.
Reply:Originally Posted by CEPI found it hard to control the depth. With a carbon arc rod, it’s just a matter how hard you push the rod into the metal. What are your thoughts?
Reply:Good to hear, I thought it was just me!Don’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:I use a Miller 2050 for light gouging. It works fine on up to say 1/4" fillets. I find the slag is a lot harder to remove than from air arced gouges. Control is OK on small gouges, but an air-arc, it ain't. I have used 1/2" electrode occasionally, but normally 3/8"-1/4" carbons. Flat carbons work extremely well also. What about getting an oxy- fuel gouging tip? I would prefer that to plasma for heavier welds
Reply:I do have a scarfing tip for my torch and it works awesome for removing welds, but it doesn't too great for gouging out cracks
Reply:I have used the 1/8" carbons a few times on my Bobcat 250 for quick jobs and it did fairly decent.  But I've heard bad things about trying to do too much of that on these weldersLast edited by Casey; 01-09-2016 at 12:26 AM.
Reply:Over the years I’ve seen carbon arc gouging diminish the welding quality of welders. I won’t do it on any of mine!Don’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:That's what I was afraid of!!
Reply:Originally Posted by CaseyThat's what I was afraid of!!
Reply:I have done both ...with a pm45 it was more laser tight even using gouge tips ...but as has been said there is places you cannot get the torch head and it's not a massive remover of metalWhere airarc removes more faster and it removes what you touch with the carbon and it creates a wide enough groove with 1/4 carbons to weld right back up with 1/8 rod doing a single passwithout grinding much ...just doing a cleaning and dross removal with the grinder...Remember that is now contaminated with carbon and needs to be removed before you weld it back upAnd plasma gouging will do stainless and aluminum and you cannot do that with airarc ...well maybe the ss but you would have to grind clean all the carbon contamination back off and outBacked my CATMA over your CARMA oops clusmy me  What would SATAN do ?? Miller Trailblazer 302 AirPakMiller Digital Elite  Optrel Welding HatArcair K4000Suitcase 12RC / 12 VSHypertherm PM-45Rage 3 sawRusty old Truck
Reply:Yeah, I have done a bit of air arc and know that it is the way to go for removing large amounts of metal, but I don't have the machine to run that right now.   I'm more interested in the gouging capabilities of the 800, I know that the 45, 65, 85 ect..  all have a specific gouge setting, that the 800 does not.   I used to have a 45 and used the gouge setting quite a bit, if the 800 worked the same as that, just with quite a bit more power, I think it would work just fine for what I want to do.  And on top of that, I would have a plasma cutter
Reply:The thing with plasma gouging is that it really does not use max power when gouging ...your not cutting so not going full depth / thickness of the metalThe gouge tips require less air pressure because you are not needing that fine laser type point and have a larger hole in the end than a cutting tipThe object being is to give the wider kerf and less penetration ...less focused to a fine point as with  a cutter which is the only different thing when you change the consumables from cut to gouge ...all the other parts are the same in the torchI use to think you needed full power to gouge with plasma as with airarc ....but have found it is quite the opposite of airarc in that respectBacked my CATMA over your CARMA oops clusmy me  What would SATAN do ?? Miller Trailblazer 302 AirPakMiller Digital Elite  Optrel Welding HatArcair K4000Suitcase 12RC / 12 VSHypertherm PM-45Rage 3 sawRusty old Truck
Reply:Originally Posted by killdozerd11The thing with plasma gouging is that it really does not use max power when gouging ...your not cutting so not going full depth / thickness of the metalThe gouge tips require less air pressure because you are not needing that fine laser type point and have a larger hole in the end than a cutting tipThe object being is to give the wider kerf and less penetration ...less focused to a fine point as with  a cutter which is the only different thing when you change the consumables from cut to gouge ...all the other parts are the same in the torchI use to think you needed full power to gouge with plasma as with airarc ....but have found it is quite the opposite of airarc in that respect
Reply:Casey in 1982 I bought this welder. Paid $9,378.00 for every thing you see. I worked for wages, and rented the welder for $650.00 a month. I put right in the rental agreement not to carbon arc with it. Attached ImagesDon’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:I use 1/4" arc air carbons at 350 amps. You can get much smaller carbons that run at much lower amps that your bobcat will run without hurting it.JasonLincoln Idealarc 250 stick/tigThermal Dynamics Cutmaster 52Miller Bobcat 250Torchmate CNC tableThermal Arc Hefty 2Ironworkers Local 720
Reply:Originally Posted by soutthpawIt seems to be really hard on inverters.   I recall Steve mentioning that some shops  keep a big old transformer machine on hand just for doing carbon arc.     Sent from mobile.  Not responsible for Typos
Reply:When i have used the 3/16 carbons they work fine but can be broken by looking at one too hardwhen you work on equipment you have to set things down to move and if you set the torch down with a 3/16 in it it will get broken ....1/4 not so muchI have tried 3/8 but they do not light so well on my TB a max output as 1/4....Maybe that was 5/16  i don't remember as i was given a few when i bought my profax now i have the k 4000...which is more or less the sameBacked my CATMA over your CARMA oops clusmy me  What would SATAN do ?? Miller Trailblazer 302 AirPakMiller Digital Elite  Optrel Welding HatArcair K4000Suitcase 12RC / 12 VSHypertherm PM-45Rage 3 sawRusty old Truck
Reply:Originally Posted by snoeproeLast job I was on, I did a pile of arc air gouging with a Lincoln Invertec v350 pro inverter welder. The machine had gouged a lot in the past. Even though the v350 could go up to 425 amps, I never went over 350 amps with 1/4" carbons when arc air gouging with it. It kept the duty cycle closer to 100%. I also did a lot of stick and mig welding with the same machine and it still welded great. I wouldn't be afraid to arc air with an inverter power supply, just don't out run the duty cycle on it.I've never seen a specific gouging option mode on the few different V350's I've used. I just set the machine to 350 amps in stick soft mode when I gouged with the v350.JasonLincoln Idealarc 250 stick/tigThermal Dynamics Cutmaster 52Miller Bobcat 250Torchmate CNC tableThermal Arc Hefty 2Ironworkers Local 720
Reply:I have the advanced process model. http://www.lincolnelectric.com/en-us...ncolnElectric)Don’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:Ahh, ok. The model with Pulse mig feature.JasonLincoln Idealarc 250 stick/tigThermal Dynamics Cutmaster 52Miller Bobcat 250Torchmate CNC tableThermal Arc Hefty 2Ironworkers Local 720
Reply:Otherwise, turning your dig or arc control to maximum will help out a lot
Reply:Originally Posted by M J DOtherwise, turning your dig or arc control to maximum will help out a lot
Reply:Originally Posted by snoeproeIt gouged fine for me without touching the arc control and using stick soft mode.
Reply:The Invertec v350 is much more adjustable than the XMT series machines. But if you check out the features and benefits in the link that CEP posted, you will see that the Invertec gouges in any mode you have it in.Last edited by snoeproe; 01-10-2016 at 05:21 PM.JasonLincoln Idealarc 250 stick/tigThermal Dynamics Cutmaster 52Miller Bobcat 250Torchmate CNC tableThermal Arc Hefty 2Ironworkers Local 720
Reply:I never used one with advance process, just the vs, I believe version. A lot less options I'm sure. Like how the new trailblazers have a gouge setting.