New to Welding need some advice

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Hey Everyone, So I'm about to finish up about 100 hours of training in a shop setting. I specialized mostly in tig with steel/ sheet metal. I have my own business as a manufacturer of firearms and I know a lot of shops use tig for repair work and fabricating sheet metal receivers. I am now in the market for a nice tig welder for my business. I think the most I can spend is about $2000 and it really doesn't need all these crazy features. I might come across cast iron parts and some aluminum occasionally but I believe for the most part it will be steel. Can you guys give an idea of what machine I might want to get, and if you guys need any more information I will be happy to supply it. Thanks.
Reply:Hello and welcome. The ability to weld alum limits your list. You'll need an AC/DC capable tig machine to do this.A good machine would be something like a used Miller Syncrowave 180 or 200. That will allow you to tig up to 1/8" alum no problem. Steel thickness would be slightly thicker. Millers Diversions or Hobart Tigmate would also fit the bill, but new they usually cost as much or more than what a nice used Syncrowave will run. I'd expect the Syncrowave to run between $800-1200 for a Syncro 180, and $900-1400 for a Syncro 200, depending on age, and what comes with them ( cylinder, rods, etc.).No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:I wouldn't be opposed to buying a slightly used machine either. But those prices are more than reasonable. Additionally, I would want a machine with a remote/pedal. That is what I've been trained to use.
Reply:I would also consider getting pulse feature as you skill probably be working with stainless as well as and really thin metal.   Pulse can help limit heat input to surrounding partTiger Sales:  AHP Distributor    www.tigersalesco.comAHP200x; AHP 160ST; MM350P,  Spoolmatic 30A; Everlast PowerTig 185; Thermal Dynamics 60i plasma.  For Sale:  Cobra Mig 250 w/ Push-pull gun.  Lincoln Wirematic 250
Reply:Where would be a good place to fine used machines in Massachusetts? Any help would be greatly appreciated.
Reply:Originally Posted by soutthpawI would also consider getting pulse feature as you skill probably be working with stainless as well as and really thin metal.   Pulse can help limit heat input to surrounding part
Reply:I use Searchtempest to search CL for machines. For a general search I use the search term "welder" and sort the list manually. If you have a specific machine you are looking for, then that might be my 2nd search term, but keep it as general as possible. For Syncrowaves, I'd use "Syncrowave" as my term and that would pull up any of the models. "tig" might also be an option. Some times you'll find really good deals on CL because a company is simply trying to keep the bills paid and are getting rid of machines they simply don't use enough to warrant keeping them around vs selling them for quick cash to cover bills for another month. I've seen several guys here buy really nice like new Syncrowaves this way. Some with less than 100 hours of use. That's pretty much new in the box practically.Don't discount older machines either. Big older industrial tigs like Miller 320/330 AB/P's and their Airco counter parts often go dirt cheap. I've seen the Airco rebardeged Millers sell as low as $250, and the Miller machines typically start $400-900. They are big heavy ( 900 lbs) and want a fair amount of power if you use them at full capacity, but they are very nice machines. Be sure if you get one you try and find one with the pedal when you get it as they can be a bit hard to locate on their own. I can think of at least a dozen members that have these, if not more and all love them. They aren't fancy and have all the newer bells and whistles, but they are good solid work horses. The old Lincoln Idealarc tigs and Miller Dialarc HF units are also nice options that often sell really inexpensively. Again try and get the pedal if possible when you buy. SSC sells replacement pedals for some, but not all older machines. On Ebay some times guys want insane amounts of money for older pedals.Auctions are often a good place to look for older machines like this. Businesses that are closing usually either due to a death of an owner or simply because the owner is retiring are often good places to look for older machines like this. Many times they go for scrap value or less. Auctions where the owner simply can't afford to keep the doors open is a decent place to look for both older machines as well as newer models..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:maybe it's just location but i haven't seen a decent sync 250 listed less than 1500 if that.  i've been pouring over CL the last month and the only sync 250 I saw for cheap was $1000 and pretty beat to **** on the outside. still worked though supposedly. don't think i've seen one listed below 1800 honestly, though maybe you could get that down to 1500.
Reply:I doubt for someone who does firearms, a machine as large as a Syncro 250 is needed. They are great machines, but probably over kill for his work. On average unless he's doing alum, I doubt he'll be over 100 amps, so many of the smaller entry level home hobby grade tigs will do just fine. If he was going to feed it a steady diet of 1/8" alum then the extra power and duty cycle of the bigger machine would be warranted.Firearms are of interest to a lot of us. be sure to post up some picts of what you do. We all love pictures..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:Originally Posted by DSWI doubt for someone who does firearms, a machine as large as a Syncro 250 is needed. They are great machines, but probably over kill for his work. On average unless he's doing alum, I doubt he'll be over 100 amps, so many of the smaller entry level home hobby grade tigs will do just fine. If he was going to feed it a steady diet of 1/8" alum then the extra power and duty cycle of the bigger machine would be warranted.Firearms are of interest to a lot of us. be sure to post up some picts of what you do. We all love pictures.
Reply:I listed those in post #2. The Syncrowave 180 and Syncrowave 200 used would fit your needs and budget. The Syncrowave 250 is just a bit bigger than you really need, but if you found one under $1500 I wouldn't pass on it just because it has a bit more output than you need. All are great machines that I've used. My personal machine is a Syncrowave 200 and the tech school I help teach at has at least 9 Syncrowave 250's.In post 7 I suggested older machines that would work and keep costs even lower. Miller 320's or 330 AB/P's, Miller Dialarc HF's, or Lincoln Idealarc Tigs. would all be solid choices, but larger and heavier weight wise.New the Syncrowave 210's are just above your budget. I'd have to see with Millers rebate program if the price squeaks under $2K or not..No government ever voluntarily reduces itself in size. Government programs, once launched, never disappear. Actually, a government bureau is the nearest thing to eternal life we'll ever see on this earth! Ronald Reagan
Reply:http://www.ebay.com/itm/Miller-Synch...15fdc#shpCntIdIs this a good deal? It looks like it's in pretty good condition and within a reasonable driving distance. What kind of questions should I ask the seller?Last edited by IRF; 11-20-2014 at 09:57 AM.
Reply:Originally Posted by IRFhttp://www.ebay.com/itm/Miller-Synch...15fdc#shpCntIdIs this a good deal? It looks like it's in pretty good condition and within a reasonable driving distance. What kind of questions should I ask the seller?
Reply:Originally Posted by shovelonMaybe a good deal if it can be tested. The cooler alone may be worth $300 bucks alone if the pump inside is a ProCon and also in working condition. With the power limitations I would consider this an entry level tig. Personally I could not be bothered with that tig, but I do like the cooler. For me inverter is the way to go. Like DSW said, the Sync210 inverter can't be beat. It is also very upgradeable and has that 3 year warranty. I would also make sure you have high speed pulse up to at least 200pps. My ThermalArc400 loves 60pps on thin inside fillets, and 500 pps outside fillets. Mold and die work(very similar to gunsmith welding) about 100pps. My Dynastys like to be 40pps above my ThermalArc.On the alum side adjustable frequency is becoming just as valuable as balance control. Again the inverter arc is very different than transformer. Then there is the monthly power bill. With 6 tigs all running simultaneously at any given time, I just can afford transformer bills anymore.Now I do production, so my ROI realizes very quickly. If I can get a solid 3 years out of a tig I am in the money, especially if it smokes under warranty. 5 to 8 years windfall. Yours should last a lifetime, so spend accordingly. You might consider this. If you win the ebay listing, and everything works, use it for a year, then look for an upgrade.
Reply:I found a used Miller syncwave 250 with tigrunner in my price range within driving distance. Thing is I don't know if it's working. I sent him a message, would this be a good welder to get?
Reply:Originally Posted by IRFI found a used Miller syncwave 250 with tigrunner in my price range within driving distance. Thing is I don't know if it's working. I sent him a message, would this be a good welder to get?
Reply:Originally Posted by soutthpawThat was the machine to have prior to the Inverter machines getting popular.   About the best machine out there for the money on the used market.   And you will probably be able to sell it for around what you bought it for if you ever decide to get something different
Reply:Originally Posted by shovelon... pulse ...
Reply:Is the noise really that bad? Anyone have any ideas on how to run this machine at my house for the time being with no specialized power outlets?
Reply:DC TIG without pulse is almost silent. The only noise is the machine fan when it kicks in and the quiet hiss of argon.AC TIG and DC pulsed TIG both make a high frequency sound. Like a "bzzzzzz" that varies with the frequency setting you choose. Not as noisy as a power tool, maybe about the same decibels as hot frying something in a wok or pan. Or running a tap full speed into a sink or whatever. You don't need hearing protection but it's noisy and it's right next to your head.DC w/o pulse is a joy in comparison.
Reply:Originally Posted by IRFJust going to be an issue powering it without the right kind of power socket would a step up adapter work for these machines I believe it's a 480 volt 3 phase?
Reply:Originally Posted by metaljongDC TIG without pulse is almost silent. The only noise is the machine fan when it kicks in and the quiet hiss of argon.AC TIG and DC pulsed TIG both make a high frequency sound. Like a "bzzzzzz" that varies with the frequency setting you choose. Not as noisy as a power tool, maybe about the same decibels as hot frying something in a wok or pan. Or running a tap full speed into a sink or whatever. You don't need hearing protection but it's noisy and it's right next to your head.DC w/o pulse is a joy in comparison.
Reply:Interesting. Common settings for me are 75% high, 40% background, 150-250pps, amps 10-20% higher than with no pulse. These are noisy parameters for me, regardless of main amps/metal thickness. I do like pulse but I love the silence of no pulse.I'm curious what sorts of pulse parameters you commonly use, or if you just vary things a lot dependent on the job. Maybe the noise I get is a reflection of my inexperience and bad settings. I have confidence in other things, like arc length and travel speed etc. Maybe my self taught pulse is wrong and I should also aim for a quiet hiss.Sorry for the thread drift, OP.
Reply:I think I've decided to go with a new Miller Diversion 180 AC/DC Tig welder. It has everything I need and in a few years I can upgrade. With the rebate it's a steal at about $1650. Is this a wise decision for the occasional welding?
Reply:Originally Posted by metaljongInteresting. Common settings for me are 75% high, 40% background, 150-250pps, amps 10-20% higher than with no pulse. These are noisy parameters for me, regardless of main amps/metal thickness. I do like pulse but I love the silence of no pulse.I'm curious what sorts of pulse parameters you commonly use, or if you just vary things a lot dependent on the job. Maybe the noise I get is a reflection of my inexperience and bad settings. I have confidence in other things, like arc length and travel speed etc. Maybe my self taught pulse is wrong and I should also aim for a quiet hiss.Sorry for the thread drift, OP.Originally Posted by IRFI think I've decided to go with a new Miller Diversion 180 AC/DC Tig welder. It has everything I need and in a few years I can upgrade. With the rebate it's a steal at about $1650. Is this a wise decision for the occasional welding?
Reply:Originally Posted by IRFI think I've decided to go with a new Miller Diversion 180 AC/DC Tig welder. It has everything I need and in a few years I can upgrade. With the rebate it's a steal at about $1650. Is this a wise decision for the occasional welding?
Reply:So I did something stupid at welding class tonight. I tried one of the tig welders with pulse on. It was like night and day. With the right settings I found that my welds were perfect and I didn't have to put much effort or control to get the desired effect I was looking for. So back to the drawing board. I want a machine with pulse that is in my price range. Thoughts?
Reply:Originally Posted by IRFSo I did something stupid at welding class tonight. I tried one of the tig welders with pulse on. It was like night and day. With the right settings I found that my welds were perfect and I didn't have to put much effort or control to get the desired effect I was looking for. So back to the drawing board. I want a machine with pulse that is in my price range. Thoughts?
Reply:Originally Posted by soutthpawYou don't want the machine compensating for lack of skill.  Leave pulse off until you can do the same welds without it.