Classic 300D questions

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I've had this machine for quite some time, but it doesn't get much use as I use my Miller 304xmt 4 pack at the shop for the bulk of my work.  Additionally, I do not care for the Classic 300D as a pipe welding machine. Although I can weld pipe roots either up or downhand, I prefer to weld them uphand.  This machine fails miserably at that. Here is why:  When the voltage tap (left dial) is set any higher than the first position on the right, the arc pops out if the fine current rage selector is anywhere below 50. So... I have to set the voltage tap at the first position, which is the lowest setting and jack the fine current adjustment up to 70 plus, before the arc will respond the way I want.  I want a strong stable arc ALL the way thru the range of voltage tap selection, and the fine current adjustment.  I was appallled when this was stated by Lincoln and printed by Lincoln on page B-2 of the owners manual for this machine.  Is there any way to remedy this?Also, I'm gettin' on in years and I have forgotten some of the technical stuff I learned back in the day.  If the voltage tap is set at 190-120, what is the correct setting on the fine current selector for 175 amps?  Is it 55? I kinda forgot how that works. I weld by feel of the arc and heat, not so much by the numbers on the machine.
Reply:Josey,I've got the identical machine on my truck.  I can't read all of your original post for some reason.  The text on the right hand side is cut off.  Could you repost, without the photo so I can read all of your original posting?I'm guessing at your questions, so if these aren't the answers you're looking for post again.  The fine adjustment control adjusts open circuit voltage(OCV) and amperage, within the range shown for the tap selector(on the left side of the panel)  A low setting on the fine adjust gives you a softer arc.  This means different things to different people.  In my mind a softer arc has less aggressive digging action and better wetting into the bevel sides.  A high setting on the fine adjust gives you an arc with more digging action.The taps ranges on the left side switch overlap, so you have some ability to select the type of arc you want at the same amperage.  The minimum output for this machine is ~40 amps, so the lowest tap has a full range of 50 amps.  Selecting the lowest tap, and setting the fine adjust to 100 gives you ~90 amps.  Setting the fine adjust to 50 while on the lowest tap gives you about 65 amps.To get 175 amps, you could use 2 different settings.  Select the 190-120 tap, and then set teh fine adjust to about 65.  Option 2 is to set the tap selector to 240-160, and then set the fine adjustment to 20.  Option 2 would give you a really low OCV at 175 amps.  I could see having troubles with them sticking.  Option 1 is the setting I would chose, knowing nothing about what you're trying to do.I haven't played around with settings that use the fine adjust below 50 on my machine.  I've not done any searching to find out what Lincoln meant when they labeled the fine adjust below 50 for 'special applications'.  Maybe one of the other pipeliners will post with their own experiences.Benson's Mobile Welding - Dayton, OH metro area - AWS Certified Welding Inspector
Reply:Thanks for the quick response.   I'm off to work, but I will clean it up as soon as I am able.  Been working seven days a week without much time to do anything.
Reply:highlight the text and paste it into notpad.  you can then read the hidden text.  to the OP, if you resize your pix to  Originally Posted by A_DAB_will_doJosey,  Could you repost, without the photo so I can read all of your original posting?.
Reply:Thanks Fredf.  Lean something new everyday.OK, so now I've read the full text of the OP.  Without knowing what kind of rods and joints you're welding, it's tough for me to offer any more advice.  I'll take a wild guess and say:Using the first tap, 90-min(40), and a fine adjust of 70-80, gives you about 75-80 amps.  If you're running root pass uphill with E6010, 1/8" diameter, 3/32" root opening and land;  I'd call this just about right.  If you're using 5/32" E6010 rod, I'd think you'd manage uphill with the fine adjust up near 100, or at about 90 amps.  If you jump up to the second tap, 130-80, with the same joint setup, you're going to be running too hot, or with a really low OCV, which I think might explain the sticking and loss of arc you commented on.  It's all different if you're running downhill or something besides EXX10 rod....Is any of this helping, or am I just adding to the confusion? Originally Posted by fredfhighlight the text and paste it into notpad.  you can then read the hidden text.  to the OP, if you resize your pix to < 600 pixels wide you wont have the problem
Reply:Do you want to sell this machine?
Reply:I'm not going to sell the machine.  I just had the K623-1 wire feed module installed the other day.  I am a huge fan of the LN-25 and I like to run wire where & when it is practical. Although you can run the wire on CC, I prefer the CV. I would say though.. that other engine driven welding machines I have used ( ie.Miller Pipe Pro & Miller Big 40) provide a  much more stable arc for running E6010 electrodes  from 3/32" - 5/32" for an uphand root pass.  Lincoln dropped the ball big time on this one.
Reply:To each his own Josey.  I've welded with Big Miller engine drives, bobcats, and my lincoln; and I definitely prefer the arc character offered by my 300D.  That said, I like Miller's XMT and dynasty machines too.  They can all get the job done, but they're all a little different too.Not sure how/why you ended up with your Lincoln.  Mine was the best deal I could find when I was shopping for a mid-sized diesel powered engine drive.  Maybe you'll find somebody who wants to swap your machine for a Big40 or Diesel Trailblazer? Originally Posted by Josey WalesI'm not going to sell the machine.  I just had the K623-1 wire feed module installed the other day.  I am a huge fan of the LN-25 and I like to run wire where & when it is practical. Although you can run the wire on CC, I prefer the CV. I would say though.. that other engine driven welding machines I have used ( ie.Miller Pipe Pro & Miller Big 40) provide a  much more stable arc for running E6010 electrodes  from 3/32" - 5/32" for an uphand root pass.  Lincoln dropped the ball big time on this one.
Reply:I bought the machine brand new out of the box about 8 years ago ($9,121.00).  Back in the eighties, I was used to welding pipe with the SA 200's, and loved the arc characteristic(s).  The classic 300D does not have those same characteristics (IMHO).  I spoke with the head engineer for Lincoln (I don't feel right putting his name on here) back when I bought it and he told me that they did make some changes to the 300D. I don't remember what he said the changes were, I just know they/he made them.  Why would they mess with a perfect formula is beyond me.  I quote verbatim from page B2 of the owners manual for this machine:  "Some arc instability may be experienced with EXX10 electrodes when trying to operate with long arc techniques at settings at the lower end of the open circuit voltage range".A machine that costs 9G's plus, with all copper windings may experience arc instability??????     What a joke.  Lincoln lost my business for there engine driven welders.Last edited by Josey Wales; 09-26-2009 at 08:52 PM.Reason: re-wording
Reply:Must have something to do with the volt/amp curve they designed into the machine.  E6010 electrodes need a higher OCV, I think, in order to burn correctly.  As I mentioned earlier, if you select a lower tap setting, and then use a higher setting on the fine adjustment, you should be able to keep the OCV up high enough to prevent any issues.I know that this machine burns E7018 rods smoother than any other machine I've ever used.  I use a lot more E7018 in the work I typically do.  I do use E6010 as well, and haven't had the problems you're describing; probably because I follow the advice I mentioned above.In any case, better luck to you going forward.  Originally Posted by Josey WalesI quote verbatim from page B2 of the owners manual for this machine:  "Some arc instability may be experienced with EXX10 electrodes when trying to operate with long arc techniques at settings at the lower end of the open circuit voltage range".A machine that costs 9G's plus, with all copper windings may experience arc instability??????     What a joke.  Lincoln lost my business for there engine driven welders.
Reply:Here is what sucks.  I am a pipe guy. 25 years now.  And the Lincoln Electric Company  took us for a ride.  Arc instability?   A thousand times over..... Arc instability?
Reply:Originally Posted by Josey Wales  "Some arc instability may be experienced with EXX10 electrodes when trying to operate with long arc techniques at settings at the lower end of the open circuit voltage range".
Reply:Feets,My 300d is useless when trying to weld small bore bore pipe (2"-4") using 5P employing the uphand technique.  Even when I set the voltage tap to the lowest setting, and turn up the fine current adjustment.  Specifically, the arc pops out until the fine current adjustment is up in the higher  ranges such as 70-100.  By those settings the arc won't pop out anymore, but it is way to hot to put the root in.  Lincoln could have prevented this. Period.  Furthermore, this has nothing to do with your schpeel about a welder should be able to pass with whatever machine he's using.  Josey
Reply:Ok, I admit my last post was a drunken rant and it is apparently too old for me to edit it now so I guess it's stuck on the record.What happens when you go to the next higher range and run the fine dial on the lower end? This should dig a bit more and hopefully snuff out less or will it still be too hot?Last edited by feetfats; 12-02-2010 at 04:03 PM.
Reply:It's of no use. I have tried that, as well as any setting combinations you can imagine.  But to answer your question specifically at that setting(s), the arc pops out while trying to long arc an uphill root on small bore pipe.  Effectually, the fine current adjustment has no "oomph" at the lower ranged settings (0-70), no matter what the voltage tap is set at.  There is absolutely no reason that a Lincoln welding machine should suffer arc pop out at any range selected.   When I use my XMT-304 four pak in the shop (and field) it reminds me of what the 300D I have should be like.  No arc pop out ever.  And no worries about the rant Feets, I didn't take it personal.Josie
Reply:You probably know all of this already but here's some of the things I've found that can cause arc pops.Welding cablesExtension cord on the remote control boxRheostatMain brushesDirty exciter slip ringsGenerator and engine rubber mountsAir filterLow engine RPMWeak cylinder compressionLow OCV.  (I like around 102 to 104 volts on 300Ds)Good luck
Reply:Hey Slowhand,Thanks for the suggestions, but the machine acted like this from day one.  I can't remember the last time I used it to weld pipe.  It must be years now.  It does well in other applications such as general welding, but it is definitely not my go to for pipe.  As I mentioned earlier, I spoke with the head engineer for lincoln electric.  He told me in no uncertain terms that Lincoln made specific changes to that product line.  I do not remember exactly what the changes were, but he told me that it was designed not to weld like the SA-200's we were all used to.  How's that for some genius decision making?Josey
Reply:Originally Posted by Josey Walesbut he told me that it was designed not to weld like the SA-200's we were all used to.  How's that for some genius decision making?
Reply:can a guy install one of those knobs like the newer 300d's have so that you can fine tune the arc?
Reply:I don't believe so.That knob is the RPM adjustment knob that operates an electronic throttle assembly.  To my knowledge only the Kubota engines that Lincoln offers on the 200D and 300D has the necessary electronic throttle for this to work.  All the other engines, like my old Perkins 200D,  are mechanical throttle only.  They have simple stop-bolts that limits the high and low idle positions of the throttle.The only other machine (besides the Kubota's) I'm aware of having electronic throttle was the 200G with its GM gas engine.I have my opinion why they went with an external RPM adjustment on these machines - after wearing out 2 stop bolts on my old Perkins mechanical throttle.  Good luckLast edited by slowhand; 12-04-2010 at 03:42 PM.
Reply:Most of the arc instability is related to the little $4 dollar control bridge located next to the fuse behind the front panel. Most of them were 25 Amp 250 volt.  Because of the heat (voltage rating) these things have to endure, they'd start to leak 1/4 wave AC into the control  circuit. Because of the disimular metals  and lack of a heat paste (aluminum and the frame steel) they's also quickly corrode.If you were to change that bridge to say a 35 amp 800 volt unit. Your arc problems simply vanished.
Reply:Cruizer,Are you legitimizing my complaint (I hope so)?  Does anyone with a 300D experience the same thing I've been talking about?  I correlate the arc pop out to pressing your gas pedal halfway to the floor, and nothing happens.  The weldor should have full power of the arc thru the ENTIRE range(s) selected.JW
Reply:Josey, If its not expensive you should give this a try and report back.I would give it a go but I am not welding any pipe yet so I doubt I would notice the difference. I may break out this winter so It would be nice to know if it works for you or not as you seem to be pretty in tune with how your machine welds.
Reply:i just bought  a 1997 300D from my buddy,..i am a sa 200 man,..but had been recently been having problems with my 200's...anyways i weld pipe everyday and after a few days of getting use to the 300 i am starting to like the 300d a whole lot ..............GOD MACHINE !
Reply:Originally Posted by Josey WalesI bought the machine brand new out of the box about 8 years ago ($9,121.00).  Back in the eighties, I was used to welding pipe with the SA 200's, and loved the arc characteristic(s).  The classic 300D does not have those same characteristics (IMHO).  I spoke with the head engineer for Lincoln (I don't feel right putting his name on here) back when I bought it and he told me that they did make some changes to the 300D. I don't remember what he said the changes were, I just know they/he made them.  Why would they mess with a perfect formula is beyond me.  I quote verbatim from page B2 of the owners manual for this machine:  "Some arc instability may be experienced with EXX10 electrodes when trying to operate with long arc techniques at settings at the lower end of the open circuit voltage range".A machine that costs 9G's plus, with all copper windings may experience arc instability??????     What a joke.  Lincoln lost my business for there engine driven welders.Originally Posted by A_DAB_will_doJosey,I've got the identical machine on my truck.  I can't read all of your original post for some reason.  The text on the right hand side is cut off.  Could you repost, without the photo so I can read all of your original posting?I'm guessing at your questions, so if these aren't the answers you're looking for post again.  The fine adjustment control adjusts open circuit voltage(OCV) and amperage, within the range shown for the tap selector(on the left side of the panel)  A low setting on the fine adjust gives you a softer arc.  This means different things to different people.  In my mind a softer arc has less aggressive digging action and better wetting into the bevel sides.  A high setting on the fine adjust gives you an arc with more digging action.The taps ranges on the left side switch overlap, so you have some ability to select the type of arc you want at the same amperage.  The minimum output for this machine is ~40 amps, so the lowest tap has a full range of 50 amps.  Selecting the lowest tap, and setting the fine adjust to 100 gives you ~90 amps.  Setting the fine adjust to 50 while on the lowest tap gives you about 65 amps.To get 175 amps, you could use 2 different settings.  Select the 190-120 tap, and then set teh fine adjust to about 65.  Option 2 is to set the tap selector to 240-160, and then set the fine adjustment to 20.  Option 2 would give you a really low OCV at 175 amps.  I could see having troubles with them sticking.  Option 1 is the setting I would chose, knowing nothing about what you're trying to do.I haven't played around with settings that use the fine adjust below 50 on my machine.  I've not done any searching to find out what Lincoln meant when they labeled the fine adjust below 50 for 'special applications'.  Maybe one of the other pipeliners will post with their own experiences.
Reply:Here we go again.  The 300d runs at 1800 because it has an A/C exciter alternator and offers 60hertz A/C auxiliary power at its receptacles.  Turn the RPMs down and you won't have the rated (standard US) 60 hertz power anymore nor will the exciter put-out rated power.  This A/C exciter also excites the main armature (after being converted to DC of course) by a diode rectifier I think (?).  The output of the exciter then should be 60 hertz DC. (I can only assume)   Of course the output of the main generator is DC as you expect.The SA and 200d machines has a DC exciter generator (instead of an A/C alternator like the 300d).  This current does not need rectifying nor does these machines offer A/C auxiliary power at its receptables (only DC).  The DC exciter also excited the main generator which in turn makes the big welding current.Some of the older SA machines ran at 1400 I think and some at 1450 rpms.  These too were DC exciter models like more modern 1550 SA and 200d machines, and these too excited the main generator.  The difference in the rated rpms is the difference in the needed input current to the fields and windings on the main generator and also the output of the exciter generator. (I think)  lolThe difference between the SA 1550 rpm and the 200d 1600 factory set engine speed (and published OCV) is the rated output of the exciter and also of the main generator.  These must meet the published numbers.  The main generator windings and armature also must make the published rated output.hope this helps.Its been a long day so if I made mistakes above then I'm sorry man.  Later guys Last edited by slowhand; 03-02-2011 at 07:51 PM.
Reply:Those Red D Arcs will do the very same as that Lincoln 300D.. Was using a Miller 40 the other day, and I wanted to throw a Grinder at it! Switch from 6010 to 7018, and you're out running to change ranges!  A Miller Welding Machine is the Equivalence to a Poorly taken care of 'Lincoln Welder' that finally, finally someone had to put it out of its misery by not giving it any oil.. After this, the Lincoln is then Painted "Blue", these Big Honkin remotes are also aided with the Machine, and the Settings?!! Yikes!  goofy asbackwards Miller Machines!! Don't ask how to make a Soft or stiff arc on those things! Just do the Opposite of what Lincoln does!Last edited by REsField; 03-04-2011 at 08:56 PM.
Reply:That reminds me of (another) old story.  Back in 1984 the work was bad and I found myself working single hand in NJ on a tank farm welding on 16" xray pipe and one day the contractor brought me a miller big 40 to weld with.  Every time I had my helper turn my heat that darn machine would stick my rod.  No matter what heat I was running man that thing would just quit welding and stick.  Trying to run a stringer bead was nothing but an aggravation.  I put up with that crap for awhile then one time it stuck and I just flew mad and drug my rod holder over to where the ground was connected and clipped onto the ground clamp.  That big 40 reved up - then I walked over to the front of the machine and started turning knobs.  Yea,  I turned THE BIG KNOB!!!!!    The one that says "do not turn while welding".   I told my helper "don't say nothing"!!!!!I turned on that big knob until that sucker reved down.  When it reved down I unhooked the stinger cable from the ground clamp and killed the engine.  A little later my foreman (this little short Italian dude) came over and ask why I wasn't welding - like I was supposed to be doing?  I told him that piece of crap machine laid down on me and it won't do nothing no more.He worked on that big 40 for awhile then went and got his fancy mechanic. Then both of them worked on it for awhile then they left.  Needless to say they never got it welding nor did they figure out that the finger board was completely burned out either.  Then they brought me an old rusty abused sa200 on a trailer.  I was happy man.  I was smiling from ear to ear when I saw that old sa200 was coming to me.    After a little tuning on it for a few minutes it would weld as good as any machine I'd ever been on.  It was old man and rusty and beat up,  but that old 200 was a good machine.Then I was happy. AFAIK they never did get that big 40 welding while I was there.  They did ask me a few times what it did when it quit welding.  I just told them it was a piece of crap welding machine and it just simply died on me. What else could I say?  It never broke arc on me again though.   Later guys.Last edited by slowhand; 03-04-2011 at 09:50 PM.