change O rings ??

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Hi,  I bought a victor power-force 2 off a guy N.I.B  but it sat in his garage for 13 years unopened.  the stuff is clean and looks like it was purchased today.But should i replace the rubber O rings in the torch and welding tips they are not cracked as i can tell ?  thanks.  Will
Reply:If they aren't cracked, you should be good to go. Good score on this kit.
Reply:Originally Posted by 12V71If they aren't cracked, you should be good to go. Good score on this kit.
Reply:O-rings are dirt cheap. No reason not to. My last time in the guy I asked for two and the guy gave me about 5 each and said no charge. I gave him 5 bucks anyway just for being a nice guy and giving me a minutes attention on his lunch break."The things that will destroy America are prosperity at any price, peace at any price, safety first instead of duty first, the love of soft living and the get rich quick theory of life." -Theodore Roosevelt
Reply:Last year I tried to buy o-rings for my small Harris torch at the LWS, counter man said they won't sell just the parts, they will take it to be sent out... liability issue. Lawyers strike again! Tried to buy a carb kit for my Onan a couple of weeks ago, OEM no longer available apparently because a customer's garage burned after the guy rebuilt his carb, it caught fire and he sued the parts supplier.Thunderbolt AC/DC330AB/P + Bernard coolerSyncrowave 250Oxy/Ace torchDayton 160 MIG6CF pot with 185 compressorToo much big equipmentEven more small tools
Reply:Originally Posted by OMBLast year I tried to buy o-rings for my small Harris torch at the LWS, counter man said they won't sell just the parts, they will take it to be sent out... liability issue. Lawyers strike again! Tried to buy a carb kit for my Onan a couple of weeks ago, OEM no longer available apparently because a customer's garage burned after the guy rebuilt his carb, it caught fire and he sued the parts supplier.
Reply:I just bought some off Amazon for an Acme 1-1/4" coupler for forklift propane cylinders. 100 pcs.  for just over $10.00 CAD shipped.---Meltedmetal
Reply:Originally Posted by MeltedmetalI just bought some off Amazon for an Acme 1-1/4" coupler for forklift propane cylinders. 100 pcs.  for just over $10.00 CAD shipped.
Reply:you may want to contact member OAdoctor or go to his web site www.regulatortorchrepair.com for parts.Mike
Reply:Originally Posted by winginitdo i have to use anything special from victor?  or can i just match the size at nappa ?  thanks
Reply:Originally Posted by leightrepairsyou may want to contact member OAdoctor or go to his web site www.regulatortorchrepair.com for parts.Mike
Reply:Originally Posted by OAdoctorIf the O-rings are not cracked and are still flexible, there is really no need to change them out.   However, we do sell them only here:  http://www.regulatortorchrepair.com/...r-o-rings-bulkDo not buy original Victor for a LWS.  Victor prices really high.
Reply:i would replace the o-rings just for the reason that something in the back of your head is questioning it (as you know, there kinda of  important) , i go w/ my gut feeling on stuff like that.     there cheap, my dist. charges like .40 cents apievce.      they tend to get  flattened  out,  or get wear.   when i put new ones on, they sit higher, and have more cushion.     and i can feel the diff when i thread the head onto the body by hand.Last edited by 123weld; 05-09-2016 at 10:58 PM.
Reply:yeah i think i want new ones.  i looked on that website that was posted but i don`t need 25.    thanks
Reply:They have them in smaller quantities too but you will pay shipping unless you order something else with it. Ask your LWS too.http://www.regulatortorchrepair.com/...t-small-victor---Meltedmetal
Reply:my local has them,  they are $5.37 each thats crazy but i am going to buy them, i will feel better with fresh ones. i will get them thursday when i pickup the 210mp i ordered. thanks
Reply:"OAdoctor,"  very happy to have found you and your site (thanks for that link, MeltedMetal!).  Years ago, I bought a Victor welding/cutting kit based on their little J-27 "aircraft" torch, which I think they no longer sell. I'm guessing that this kit might have sat on the shelf for a long time, and that the packing around the adjusting valves in the torch had got old and hardened up. The symptom, ever since I bought it, is that it won't hold a setting very well. Let me say that I do use Victor's recommended O/A pressures for any given tip (have you noticed that a lot of guys use way too much pressure, especially for cutting?).  After opening the acetylene valve and lighting the torch, I add oxygen and approach a neutral flame. For most welding, I'd like to have a VERY slight excess-acetylene feather, mostly so I can see that I'm not getting into the oxidizing realm. But that's where the flame will end up; without my doing anything, the proportion of oxygen keeps slowly increasing until I have an oxidizing flame. If I then try to correct in the other direction, by adding acetylene, the flame will slowly creep in the direction of a reducing flame, with a long acetylene feather. I have tried tightening and otherwise fooling with the packing nuts, but seem to end up with too-tight or too-loose. This is why I'm guessing that the packing is old and hard. So I have to keep re-adjusting for a while until the flame has stabilized to roughly what I want.Am I right, is it the packing?  Do you have fresh packing for a J-27 torch (and I'll order it for my other torches, but I don't recall their model numbers, and get fresh O-rings, too).Second question:  A lot of O/A torches, when you shut them off, still have a tiny acetylene flame left over. I assume this is valve and seat wear.  I've had a few torches repaired by a specialist, but sometimes this problem recurs rather too quickly. Some of this gear gets used by others, and depending how they shut down, I think they often get the loud pop  .  .  .  and I think there must be some kind of pressure spike that travels up the hose to the regulator.  I've had formerly-good regulators that get acetylene-pressure creep, where indicated pressure climbs slowly while the torch is shut off.  Am I right that there's a cause-and-effect relationship between the pop and the guage creep? I have had regulators overhauled, but the acetylene pressure-creep eventually recurs.  So, how do you fix that slight acetylene-valve leak, that leaves the tiny flame?  No doubt there are replacement valve stems, but are there replaceable seats in these torches, or do you have a reamer that renews the seat?If this post is redundant and you or somebody has an article that covers all of this, I'll certainly come back and delete this one.  I would like to hear specifically about the J-27 valve packing, however.ThanksLast edited by old jupiter; 05-10-2016 at 12:36 PM.
Reply:"O" rings are not rocket surgery nor do they need to be expensive. My migs require two each on the torch leads and spool guns, and they sometimes get nicked when swappin torch leads. I do not buy them as a replacement part, I instead just select them from my O ring kit....No equipment maker seems to use exotic sized O rings, so odds are the size you need is available in standard O ring kit and it will contain many each of them cheap. Years ago I bought an O ring kit made in USA and dig in it often. It was not expensive and I see they still sell it cheap. I also lube O rings with just a dab of sillycone O ring lube when I remember to.Take lots of care when removing the old rings NOT to scratch the lands the rings seat in or new rings will leak. If you can find a brass dental pick, then stash it and use it just for O rings..we had them on nuc submariens and I stole a set years ago.I was a nuclear submarine mechanic for many years and we used O rings by the thousands for almost every joint so I learned lots about them. O ring kits were outlawed on nuc submarines, but I kept one hidden away and it saved many a mission and allowed us to remain at sea. Pliers were also outlawed, but I had two pair hidden away..Cresent wrenches too.
Reply:Originally Posted by wornoutoldwelder"O" rings are not rocket surgery nor do they need to be expensive...
Reply:No standard o rings fit my torch.  I have multiple sets on hand to choose from.  Migs, hydraulics, air fittings are a different story.  All standard parts.My name's not Jim....
Reply:Originally Posted by old jupiter"OAdoctor,"  very happy to have found you and your site (thanks for that link, MeltedMetal!).
Reply:Originally Posted by winginitmy local has them,  they are $5.37 each thats crazy but i am going to buy them, i will feel better with fresh ones. i will get them thursday when i pickup the 210mp i ordered. thanks
Reply:Originally Posted by BoostinjdmNo standard o rings fit my torch.  I have multiple sets on hand to choose from.  Migs, hydraulics, air fittings are a different story.  All standard parts.
Reply:Originally Posted by rlitmanI agree with you to a point.  Maybe 1% of the retail price of o-rings is for the actual cost of the o-ring.  The rest is in packaging (and counting), warehousing and markup.My o-ring kit has paid for its own weight in gold, and I'd have no qualms about using cheap o-rings from a kit in a MIG welder.That being said, there is no way in hell I'd be ok with using o-rings from a kit on an oxy-acetylene torch.  Additionally, while I agree that proper o-ring lubrication is important, and that silicone grease is often perfect for the job, silicone grease is not oxygen compatible.  That's fine on a MIG torch, not fine on an O/A torch.
Reply:Originally Posted by OAdoctorJust curious, why pay $5.37 per O-ring when we sell them for $1.50 per set?http://www.regulatortorchrepair.com/...t-small-victori'm really, really surprised to hear that just ole buna orings is ok to use.     i  really really thought they were oxygen safe o rings or something and possibly more heat resistant.        i mean the china or wherever could be stickin anything in them.    it just don't sound right.       wingit, c'mon, 6 bucks a piece, that is over a thousand percent markup over the going rate.     id have to be over a barrel, or  on a sinking ship that needed a torch to save it before i'd give in to them.   id boycott that welding store.    how you gonna feel everytime you go pick that torch up, and have to think about that.     huh, that would take all the fun out of the good deal you got on the torch.     are you out in the sticks where theres one general  store, one  doctor, one dentist, one welding store?     i'm actually contemplating mailing you a couple before what i'm hearing gets any crazierLast edited by 123weld; 05-10-2016 at 10:26 PM.
Reply:Originally Posted by 123weldi'm really, really surprised to hear that just ole buna orings is ok to use.     i  really really thought they were oxygen safe o rings or something and possibly more heat resistant.        i mean the china or wherever could be stickin anything in them.    it just don't sound right.       wingit, c'mon, 6 bucks a piece, that is over a thousand percent markup over the going rate.     id have to be over a barrel, or  on a sinking ship that needed a torch to save it before i'd give in to them.   id boycott that welding store.    how you gonna feel everytime you go pick that torch up, and have to think about that.     huh, that would take all the fun out of the good deal you got on the torch.     are you out in the sticks where theres one general  store, one  doctor, one dentist, one welding store?     i'm actually contemplating mailing you a couple before what i'm hearing gets any crazier
Reply:If you take a look at this chart, it would appear that Buna-N (nitrile) and neoprene O-rings are both good with acetylene, but that neoprene would be preferable with oxygen. After you look at the compatibility of the various O-ring recipes with acetylene, scroll down the next chart and click on "oxygen, cold." Since our employment of O-rings on torch attachments is "static" (except that we install and remove components, so abrasion resistance may be considered important). Buna-N is acceptable, too, according to this info:http://www.efunda.com/designstandard...cetylene%20GasUnfortunately, another common O-ring material, Viton, is not included in this comparison  .  .  .Also, "123weld" makes a VERY good point. If you get your O-rings out of a plastic box of assorted sizes from a hardware store (as I have done) they probably come from China, so do you really trust them to use the proper chemistry, to control the QC??  Welders already know we can't trust those people to send us welding wire with good or consistent metallurgy or a constant diameter, nor do their contact tips come with a reliable I.D..  This really has gotten to be a pain. You can't rely on anything to be what it claims to be (as we said in the discussion on keeping a supply of nuts and bolts, currently back on page 4). Thanks for reminding me of this, 123weld, because for some reason I had not thought this out when I bought the O-ring assortments, damn!!!Last edited by old jupiter; 05-11-2016 at 12:00 PM.
Reply:Originally Posted by OAdoctorYHowever,  almost all of the O-rings used on welding tips are Buna 70.
Reply:Originally Posted by rlitmanGood to know.  I learned something today.  Though the o-rings on most of the Victor tips I own are red in color, not black...One gotcha in using o-rings from a kit, is you have many to choose from.  Too often, I've tried to compare a failed o-ring against ones in my kit, and have had trouble picking the correct one.  It can be difficult to choose the correct one from several similar sizes when the failed one is compressed in one direction and swelled in another.  In this case, having an o-ring replacement pack that has the correct sizes already selected for you can prevent mistakes.
Reply:Originally Posted by old jupiterIf you take a look at this chart, it would appear that Buna-N (nitrile) and neoprene O-rings are both good with acetylene, but that neoprene would be preferable with oxygen. After you look at the compatibility of the various O-ring recipes with acetylene, scroll down the next chart and click on "oxygen, cold." Since our employment of O-rings on torch attachments is "static" (except that we install and remove components, so abrasion resistance may be considered important). Buna-N is acceptable, too, according to this info:http://www.efunda.com/designstandard...cetylene%20GasUnfortunately, another common O-ring material, Viton, is not included in this comparison  .  .  .Also, "123weld" makes a VERY good point. If you get your O-rings out of a plastic box of assorted sizes from a hardware store (as I have done) they probably come from China, so do you really trust them to use the proper chemistry, to control the QC??  Welders already know we can't trust those people to send us welding wire with good or consistent metallurgy or a constant diameter, nor do their contact tips come with a reliable I.D..  This really has gotten to be a pain. You can't rely on anything to be what it claims to be (as we said in the discussion on keeping a supply of nuts and bolts, currently back on page 4). Thanks for reminding me of this, 123weld, because for some reason I had not thought this out when I bought the O-ring assortments, damn!!!
Reply:Originally Posted by OAdoctorThe O-ring for the Small Victor Torch is not a standard size.  We purchase them from a O-ring Supplier.  The material is Buna 70, but neoprene will work as well.Most of the other O-rings are standard sizes and can be purchase at any good hardware store.  We sell O-rings for all torches, even if they are not listed here:
Reply:i did some phone calls on this, and this is what i come up w/.      victors uses  "Hypalon" o-rings (made by du pont i think)  for the 2 o -rings  that are used from rear  head to barrel.   my ever so trustworthy favorite  distributor guy ( Pat the cat) gets the o-rings from "seal seat", and they are specifically for this type of application.   i buy them for about a dollar a pair.    when i called  seal seat, i got a chain of women who know nothing, and say they don't have a tech support dept.     anyway, i rember seeing orange ones like rlitman says in past, but these i get are a matte black.
Reply:Originally Posted by 123weldi did some phone calls on this, and this is what i come up w/.      victors uses  "Hypalon" o-rings (made by du pont i think)  for the 2 o -rings  that are used from rear  head to barrel.   my ever so trustworthy favorite  distributor guy ( Pat the cat) gets the o-rings from "seal seat", and they are specifically for this type of application.   i buy them for about a dollar a pair.    when i called  seal seat, i got a chain of women who know nothing, and say they don't have a tech support dept.     anyway, i rember seeing orange ones like rlitman says in past, but these i get are a matte black.
Reply:Originally Posted by 123weldi did some phone calls on this, and this is what i come up w/.      victors uses  "Hypalon" o-rings (made by du pont i think)  for the 2 o -rings  that are used from rear  head to barrel.   my ever so trustworthy favorite  distributor guy ( Pat the cat) gets the o-rings from "seal seat", and they are specifically for this type of application.   i buy them for about a dollar a pair.    when i called  seal seat, i got a chain of women who know nothing, and say they don't have a tech support dept.     anyway, i rember seeing orange ones like rlitman says in past, but these i get are a matte black.
Reply:Originally Posted by VulcanelOAdoctor: do you carry O rings for the swivel in a Reelcraft TW7450 oxy-acetylene reel?  I am not certain of the size of them, but I will measure if you do carry them.  I can't find them anywhere.
Reply:IF I recall correctly, the kits of reddish-dyed O-rings are silicone, not good for our purpose, poor resistance against tearing and shredding.
Reply:Originally Posted by winginitBut should i replace the rubber O rings in the torch and welding tips they are not cracked as i can tell
Reply:Originally Posted by old jupiterIF I recall correctly, the kits of reddish-dyed O-rings are silicone, not good for our purpose, poor resistance against tearing and shredding.
Reply:Originally Posted by KelvinSo why change them?
Reply:Originally Posted by rlitmanThere is no way the orange/red o-rings on my Victor stuff are silicone.  I agree that silicone o-rings would be awful in a torch, but I've never seen silicone o-rings in a kit (not to say that they don't exist).  Most probably they were hypalon (as pointed out above).  It sounds like they're NBR now.  I can't think of any o-rings in a torch that would be exposed to heat, but in situations where that's a problem, HNBR (usually green in the kits) is substituted for NBR, as it has a higher heat resistance.The kits of brownish o-rings (if that is what you were thinking of) are usually viton.  That's no better or worse than NBR for abrasion resistance, but have different chemical compatibilities (though probably not relevant here).
Reply:Originally Posted by winginitI installed a complete Air conditioning system in a old for truck and the O- Rings in the kit were green.
Reply:Originally Posted by winginitBecause the torch is 13 years old never used  .,  The question was should  i change them.  this turn out to be a interesting thread.  nice !
Reply:Aw come on, Kelvin, he's trying to do preventive maintenance.
Reply:Originally Posted by KelvinWell, then, you'd better buy new torch handle, nozzles, hoses and regulators too ... after all, it's 13 years old!
Reply:Originally Posted by winginitBecause the torch is 13 years old never used  .,  The question was should  i change them.  !
Reply:Originally Posted by John TYou don't really want to hear the correct answer. You were just looking for an excuse to change them.  So get on with it and make some smoke already...Good grief.