Pipe root pass pictures and question

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Sch40 5.5" or so pipe. 1/16 land 1/16 gap 1/8 5p+85 amps dcen I believe. Just want some input on if this is what I should be shooting for every time Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:You sure your running dcen?I think 6010 should be dcep.Just a couple welders, big hammers, grinders, and torches.Work will free you.Men in dirty jeans built this country, while men in clean suits have destroyed it. Trump/Carson 2016-2024
Reply:I forget to be honest. This was with my Lincoln machine that blew up. This is something like a month ago. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:They look good to me.What kind of lincoln, and what went out on it?Hobart Beta-Mig 2511972 Miller AEAD-200LEMiller 250 TwinNorthern Ind. Hybrid 200Longevity Stick 140Longevity Migweld 200SThermal Arc Pak 3XR
Reply:Weldanpower 225/210-6 reactor melted down. Literally Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:I know someone has something to advise me on. Ears are open. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Are you running your roots up hill, or down hill?Don’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:Both. This wAs downhillSent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Hard to tell by the pictures, seems as I remember reading some where that 1/16” high reenforcement is required all the way around. But I've also read so many opinions on the subject, I don't really know what is required.Don’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:CEP, most of the codes I'm familiar with (API1104, AWS D1.1, and ASME section IX) require flush(0") to 1/8"(or 1/16") max reinforcement.  My experience has been that third-party QC or companies' internal QC often mandate stricter requirements (1/32" to 1/8") internal reinforcement.  I believe that ASME and API allow for varying amounts of "suckback" over limited distances and/or so long as the overall weld deposit thickness is greater than the base metal thickness.  Again, code says one thing, but it's a minimum requirement, a starting point.  AKweldshop, you can run 6010's in DCEN polarity.  The arc is more spraylike, with more heat focused on the bevel, rather than the rod tip.  The weld bead deposited, regardless of uphill or downhill, tends to be thinner than when the rods are run in DCEP polarity.  This thinner deposit can be more crack-prone.  Here in North America, DCEN is generally not used with 6010.  (The increased chances of cracking are way, I think).  But outside North America it is more common.  Try it out on some test joints; some guys like it.  I've heard that bead hands on pipeline jobs will occasionally use a stinger on both welding leads so it's fast and easy to swap polarity to deal with changes in fitup.  They's just swap which stinger is holding the rod and which is clipped to the grasshopper.  This is generally not in compliance with NA welding procedures; but as it was explained to me, what the inspector doesn't see....you can guess the rest.Benson's Mobile Welding - Dayton, OH metro area - AWS Certified Welding Inspector
Reply:Originally Posted by CEPHard to tell by the pictures, seems as I remember reading some where that 1/16” high reenforcement is required all the way around. But I've also read so many opinions on the subject, I don't really know what is required.
Reply:With my Everlast PowerArc 300 welder I like running 6010 on DCEN for the root pass. Also has a cool sound to it.  Attached ImagesDon’t pay any attention to meI’m just a hobbyist!CarlDynasty 300V350-Pro w/pulseSG Spool gun1937 IdealArc-300PowerArc 200ST3 SA-200sVantage 400
Reply:I'll have to try both polarities  on my new machine. That being said hopefully I can burn some rod tonight and see if I can't stack more inside the pipeSent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:I know someone else has something to say that would benefit me Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Ok here is my take on wanting your bead to stand up...... I know root pass but around here it is the bead. Ok so what I do to get it to stand up more is put a bigger land and turn up the heat and push on the rod. I don't step my beads in unless it's a wide fit or I have a big keyhole. I like to run about a heavy nickel land and gap and 45 on my remote and that figures to be about 135 amps. I push on the rod and point it straight in and drag it down. Changing rod angle up or down to open or close my key hole. I have the helper go up or down on my box as needed. The rod should just be shaving the land off and putting in the root. If you run to hot it guts it and puts a wide flat bead in.  Should feel like the rod is on a bearing and fall right in there. Speed and pressure are the name of the game putting beads in pipe. This is how I do it every day. Lots of ways to do it. This is just my method.Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:It looks wide. I think a root either uphill or downhill should look more like CEP's root. I would expect downhill to be a little smoother. Doing the initial pressure test my buddy had his root about flush and the inspector failed it but said he could weld it out for practice. The hot pass pushed the root in nice but the inspector said sorry, it was already failed. My buddy was pizzed. I had a questionable spot and asked if there was a way to fix it. The inspector said to take a hacksaw blade and cut a groove and then really push the rod in. I brought a thin zip disc and used that. My root passed but kind of looked like one pass beside the other. I think maybe because it was really hard to tell if I completely caught one edge and asked if there was a way to fix it might be why it passed.
Reply:Originally Posted by Welder DaveIt looks wide. I think a root either uphill or downhill should look more like CEP's root. I would expect downhill to be a little smoother. Doing the initial pressure test my buddy had his root about flush and the inspector failed it but said he could weld it out for practice. The hot pass pushed the root in nice but the inspector said sorry, it was already failed. My buddy was pizzed. I had a questionable spot and asked if there was a way to fix it. The inspector said to take a hacksaw blade and cut a groove and then really push the rod in. I brought a thin zip disc and used that. My root passed but kind of looked like one pass beside the other. I think maybe because it was really hard to tell if I completely caught one edge and asked if there was a way to fix it might be why it passed.
Reply:There was another guy testing that finished more than 30 minutes ahead of everyone else. Did 7 bends and his last bend opened up like a sardine can. I think he went so fast with his root that his 7018 hot pass couldn't be all that hot and also had to be fast so it wouldn't burn through. It was a 2G/5G uphill test on 6" sch. 80. I like to go a little slower and put in a heavier root. There's no worse feeling than putting in a good root only to burn through on the hot pass.
Reply:Originally Posted by Welder DaveThere's no worse feeling than putting in a good root only to burn through on the hot pass.
Reply:Alright there we go. That bead I posted a pic of I went real slow and steady watching it stack and leading the rod by about 1/32". And when it would close up kept dragging downward. I've already used rod angle to open or close my keyhole but I'm by no means a pro so I'll practice more with that. So in reality I'm looking for a narrow talk bead compared to what I have. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Originally Posted by specopswelderOk here is my take on wanting your bead to stand up...... I know root pass but around here it is the bead. Ok so what I do to get it to stand up more is put a bigger land and turn up the heat and push on the rod. I don't step my beads in unless it's a wide fit or I have a big keyhole. I like to run about a heavy nickel land and gap and 45 on my remote and that figures to be about 135 amps. I push on the rod and point it straight in and drag it down. Changing rod angle up or down to open or close my key hole. I have the helper go up or down on my box as needed. The rod should just be shaving the land off and putting in the root. If you run to hot it guts it and puts a wide flat bead in.  Should feel like the rod is on a bearing and fall right in there. Speed and pressure are the name of the game putting beads in pipe. This is how I do it every day. Lots of ways to do it. This is just my method.Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:I like that pipeline hero. Hardly get dirty as the bead hand. I know several welders who can drag the root in uphand but I think stepping it in with a keyhole is the way to go. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Originally Posted by specopswelderI like that pipeline hero. Hardly get dirty as the bead hand. I know several welders who can drag the root in uphand but I think stepping it in with a keyhole is the way to go. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:It is how I weld everything from 2 inch to 42 inch. I actually land the smaller wall thickness pipe a shade more just because the bevels can't carry as much heat. But other than that it's all the same Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Originally Posted by specopswelderIt is how I weld everything from 2 inch to 42 inch. I actually land the smaller wall thickness pipe a shade more just because the bevels can't carry as much heat. But other than that it's all the same Sent from my iPhone using TapatalkMy amperage is just a guess. The digital meters on my welder do not work. I do everything off a remote that is broken up into percentage of 300 amps. I will drop down to 38% or so on smaller pipe. I just go by feel to determine if I need more or less amps. After you put a few 1000 hours on one machine you can pretty much look at your fit a know where you need to be. You can over come a lot with speed, pressure and rod angle when it come to amperage. Every machine welds different when it comes down to what works and how you weld yourself. I weld with a guy who runs 3/16 8010 colder than I can keep a 1/8 6010 lit. Practice changing only one variable at a time and you will get it figured out.Last edited by specopswelder; 03-22-2015 at 10:17 PM.
Reply:You need a proper land for control.  i haven't downhanded in a while but you need a very uniform land and gap to make it work.  Only trick I can add to the discussion is if you have a little high-low, ie slightly bad fitup, you can osillate the stinger from side to side to help tie in the sides as you push the rod in. Originally Posted by strtspdlxStill 135amps for smaller pipe?? I run 85 and at 95 I'm unable to control it. That's also a knife edge and about 3/32 gap maybe smaller gap I usually eyeball it. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Bingo. Bakodiver hit it on the head.  I didn't read you where not using a land. That is why you are getting flat beads. What he says about high low is exactly right.  And If it's real bad take a wider gap or grind and step it in. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Sorry I'm very experienced, when you say grind and step it in exactly what are you referring too?Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Soften up the bevel with the grinder where you can burn off both sides easy and step out of the puddle and back in to put the root in. It is slow but will burn off both edges and fill in the high low and look good on an X-ray. Probably clear as mud. Next time I have a fit that I do like that I'll try and get some pics to better explain. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Sorry autocorrect keeps screwing up my words for me. I meant to say I'm not experienced. My goal is in 6-12 months to get certified I'm starting to save for them now as my lws does them and says they're about $450. I'm trying to get out of my current career and into welding. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk