Who has seen this before???

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Ok here's the scenario... Welding stainless tubing appx 1/16" wall thickness using straight argon to purge and a stubby gas lens on the torch #8 cup 15-17 cfh with no filler just penetrating and pushing the puddle along. The tubing is cleaned before welding and wiped down with mek. After establishing a puddle and welding an inch or so the puddle gets hard to control wanting to go to one side or another and acts like the amps were turned up and it's about to blow a hole. If you keep going it starts acting like you have no argon flow from the torch, or like there is moisture on the inside of what's being welded. Stop the weld and your left with what you see in the pictures.... I have seen a video on YouTube where Jody from welding tips and tricks made an inline drier for his argon hoses. My theory is bad quality argon that has somehow got bits of moisture in the bottle. There have been times when I have had to patch a hole in stainless tubing that I could not remove from place and had some amount of standing water in it and get similar results but in that case the problem is appearant. This problem I have now doesn't happen often but has popped up enough times the last few months that I want to check with the web and see if anyone else has ever seen this and if so what is the fix...Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:To me it looks like your amperage is a touch to high, and the blow out part seems like you're out gassing from pressure build up. I can see it's not happening at the end of the weld where outgassing would usually occur, but if it's tacked up real tight and your back purge is to high I can definitely see that happening. It happened to me a short while back, but with aluminum and no back purge.I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:Amps are somewhere in the 40-45 range I have a thumb wheel to control it so it varies and as far as internal pressure it's capped off with foil that has several holes poked in it and purge around 25 cfh if pressure was too high it would blow the foil off.The vast majority of my welding is on stainless tubing and I've got it down to where I can do it pretty well and rarely have problems of any kind. Our lws just changed ownership and this problem started after the gas were using was coming from a different supplier that makes me think it is related to the gas...Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Are you using a foot pedal?I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:Wrote that last one to late sorry bout that. Your purge is way to high in my opinion. Way high. I can see where it popped and flung material. Not saying it cant be a gas problem, but youre starting off well and then bam. And seems like your problem is occuring in about the same distance. Just my input bud weird. I know you have done many in the past problem free.I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:too much purge wouldn't make it all black like that, though. Whatever it is, it's a mess!
Reply:Not black tho Tim. Dark grey from overheat yes, a mess....yes lol. Funny, but not funny.I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:Luckily this hasn't happened on anything critical yet the piece in the pics was just a purge adapter I was making and the few times it has happened before I was able to cut the bad weld out and replace it or rework the part without much time wasted. If you look at the first pic you can see shiny weld underneath when this happens the first thing you see is a black scale run up the metal from the sides of the puddle... It's wierd...Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:Seems like an argon problem to me. I had this happen for now apparent reason while welding stainless one time. Adjusted the argon flow a few times from 20cfh #8 gas lens, down to 15 cfh and all was good.Millermatic 211Miller Syncrowave 350lx with cooler and tigrunner Thermal Dynamics cutmaster 811955 National Cylinder Gas O/A setup with original patina
Reply:Judging from the gap vs. the weld size that is way too hot..You are right though....Something funny is going on......zap!I am not completely insane..Some parts are missing Professional Driver on a closed course....Do not attempt.Just because I'm a  dumbass don't mean that you can be too.So DON'T try any of this **** l do at home.
Reply:Yes i did see that. Weird fer sure. I accept this with a shrug of the shoulders on repairs, but i hate when this type of problem happens on raw new material. Ill keep thinking for you tho.I hate being bi-polar it's awsomeMy Heroes Have Always Been Cowboys
Reply:Picture of your gas lens and torch head please....Miller Dynasty 200DXMiller Spectrum 250DMiller Millermatic 200Bunch of old blue dinosaurs....
Reply:Duh you are supposed to use aluminum filler when welding aluminum not stainless.Anyways regardless of what you thought your amperage was the haz is huge.  Whether it is a shielding issue or a bad potentiometer in your control circuit I would start there
Reply:That looks to me like a contaminated argon issue. Slide the tungsten in and seal the cup with your finger and see if argon builds pressure and the flow meter stops. If it doesn't, you have a leak somewhere and it could be drawing in air. Try a new bottle from a different machine that isn't having this issue to test of the argon is contaminated in the bottle.Welding/Fab Pics: www.UtahWeld.com
Reply:Originally Posted by 76GMC1500Duh you are supposed to use aluminum filler when welding aluminum not stainless.Anyways regardless of what you thought your amperage was the haz is huge.  Whether it is a shielding issue or a bad potentiometer in your control circuit I would start there
Reply:Ill throw my hat in and guess a gust of wind.Lincolin Power Wave 450, Lincoln Powermig 255, Lincoln Pro Mig 140, Lincoln Squarewave Tig 275, Miller Big 40 G(with Hobart Hefty suitcase), Thermal Arc 95S and Esab PCM875 in an already full machine shop.
Reply:Here's my torch setup it's a weldcraft #17fv with ck stubby gas lens #8 cup 2% lanthanated tungsten and medium back cap... As far as I can see everything fits tight and I've only had issues when welding tubing never on anything else...Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Reply:My first guess would have been that something interfered with the gas shield. My second guess would have been arc blow. While it's pretty uncommon with stainless, it can happen.
Reply:My comment was meant to be a joke after watching someone weld aluminum with stainless filler because he really did not know better.
Reply:I'm going to guess. :25 cfh is a lot. It's a lot for such a small workpiece, and it's a lot more than what you say you have coming from the torch. This makes sense with one of the things you said about it seeming like argon flow from the torch had stopped. Because here's what i'm imagining: High cfh and therefore high pressure in the vessel will mean outgassing at the seam you're welding, even when there are other outlets for the gas. High flow rates in liquids and gasses mean high eddie currents, and lots of surrounding gas being drawn into the stream. So you'll have a 'jet' of argon shooting out of the seam and drawing surrounding air in toward the seam. Instead of a nice gentle puddle of argon flopping out and hanging around the seam. I don't know what setup you have to have flow to both torch and purge, but if it happens to be from one source and isn't correct, then a high flow rate in one outlet will sap from the other (venturi effect). In which case the argon from the torch really could have stopped.The first thing to do is to see if this strange occurrence is repeatable in other circumstances. Can you weld other things just fine? In which case it's obviously not gas contamination. etc, etc. Test to rule things out.It's a fab life.
Reply:Looks like you got a bottle of 75/25 instead of pure argon. Have you welded any other stainless with that bottle of gas? Had it happen to me once, mislabelled bottle. Pulled my hair out for 2 days trying to figure out the problem.Miller Thunderbolt AC/DC (Sold)Miller Dialarc 250HFMiller MM251Miller MM200 (Sold)Miller MM130Miller Spot WelderVictor O/A rigMiller Spoolmatic 1 (Sold)
Reply:Is your purge and shielding gas out of the same bottle? Have you taken a clean scrap piece and made an arc on it and seen the difference? after making a test weld does the tungsten still look clean? In our shop we have had a problem in the past of getting bad argon, with a high impurity content but was still within in industry standards which do not meet ours. Ended up switching to certified gas. If your tungsten comes out dirty with a good post purge then that is a good indication of bad gas or a hole/crack that's sucking in air. Also I would agree with the blow out part having a high purge. you could tape closed the groove and leave the foil on the top with smaller holes running a lot less gas (8-10), once the part is purged out for a good few minutes pull open a small area of tape and weld it up.
Reply:its the gas, even a 100% helium wouldn't do that. I had a mislabeled bottle once. have a pic of the bottle